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 Post subject: DISTANCE ... NO MORE B.S.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 4:35 am 
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Location: Florida
I regularly see kiters standing and riding close to and upwind of bystanders, swimmers, surfers ...

BECAUSE we can handle it.

We never lose control, have breakage, have gusts/lulls or simply screw up. Not us.

I've heard about two reported bystander incidents recently involving line cuts with serious consequences. No one was killed, lost a lot of blood but there were lasting effects in each case.

BOTH ACCIDENTS WERE TOTALLY AVOIDABLE, as is virtually always the case. Distance ALONE would have stopped the incidents from happening.

Time to get real, no more B.S., skill can handle it crap! This sport is being slammed by too much indifference and stupid practice. This stuff is so obvious as are the consequences of continuing.

Some of these bystanders may not be as understanding or forgiving of future easily avoided incidents. Ideas for trying to protect bystanders, access and yourself appear at the link below.


Last edited by RickI on Fri Jun 11, 2004 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 6:16 am 
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Location: Leeuwarden, Netherlands.
I totally agree. Some people don't seem to understand that an accident can happen before you can even react. I know how sharp a kiteline under tension can be. It once cut a pice of my finger off. I don't want to think of the effect on an arm or leg...................
It's not only the distance between the kiter and the bystander, but also the distance between the kiters themselves. Last week I had a close call. While I was laying in the water ready to go, someone sent his kite right into my lines. The two kites were about tangle around each others lines. On that moment I decided to pull my QR, but just before I could pull it, my kite hindenburged and the problem was solved. Distance would have been the only way to avoid this to happen.

DISTANCE is the only way to avoid accidents.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 6:27 am 
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Location: Corpus Christi, Tx
yep totaly agree. its one thing when u endanger urself...but when there are people that have no clue about kiting and u put them in jepordy its just wrong and stupid.

people should have better judgement...overconfidence is a bad thing.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 11:16 am 
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Location: Florida
Good point, other riders are possibly the second most likely people to be involved and hurt by being too close when something goes wrong.

The rider himself is MOST at risk of injury through lack of distance as proven by MANY repeated accidents.

Bystanders may follow other riders in terms of risk.


Distance is your friend ... USE IT


... or be prepared to LOSE IT, (access, health, assets, quality of life and respect).

Count upon it, time to get real and responsible.


Last edited by RickI on Fri Jun 11, 2004 4:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 11:25 am 
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The only thing that will save your ass when the shit hits the fan is a big empty beach downwind


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 12:44 pm 
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everyone has to have the balls to go up and tell the dangerous show offs to cut the crap!!!
do it or lose your spots

kiteman


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:01 pm 
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Lord of the Boards wrote:
I totally agree. Some people don't seem to understand that an accident can happen before you can even react. I know how sharp a kiteline under tension can be. It once cut a pice of my finger off. I don't want to think of the effect on an arm or leg...................
It's not only the distance between the kiter and the bystander, but also the distance between the kiters themselves. Last week I had a close call. While I was laying in the water ready to go, someone sent his kite right into my lines. The two kites were about tangle around each others lines. On that moment I decided to pull my QR, but just before I could pull it, my kite hindenburged and the problem was solved. Distance would have been the only way to avoid this to happen.

DISTANCE is the only way to avoid accidents.


Wrapping lines is a dodgy thing for at least one or perhaps both riders and bystanders downwind. Remembering what happened to Silke and others with less tragic results it would be good to consider what you would do IF you wrap lines with someone.

I would say it would be good to get into a position to release your control bar immediately. Then to yell at the other rider to verify that he has done the same thing and then to drop your bars more or less at the same time. This approach could still result in problems in theory (failed kite depowering, uneven release of kites, etc.), ideally it should minimize the hazards to both riders.

What has happened quite often is that one rider immediately depowers sometimes without a leash or I imagine it wouldn't take much to have your leash ripped free and the other guy is stuck with a double powered, out of control pair of kites. If he doesn't have a reliable QR he could well end up in a very bad situation as happened to Silke. The best solution of course is avoidance .... D I S T A N C E , saves the day yet again in another way.

What have you folks experienced out there? I am around other riders rarely so wrapping lines is an infrequent experience for me. The last time it happened at a crowded event in Miami, I flew my kite away from the other guys lines almost instantly removing the hazard. Still, what if this doesn't workout, then what? We should talk about this.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:34 pm 
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As a newbie, I'm sometimes in the path of more experienced riders and have to leave it up to them to avoid a collision - I don't have the skills to avoid them, they have the skills to avoid me. Yell all you want about starboard tack or whatever - my options are limited at this stage. And guys who are up and planing should yield right-of-way to anyone still in the water, right?

You can spot a newbie a mile away - give us some space please... Last session I spent about 1/3 of the time waiting for other guys (one in particular) to get a safe distance away - I'll never get good enough to stay out of your way if I spend all my time with the kite parked...

Just go further upwind - we won't be there until we have real skills.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:53 pm 
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Hi Rick,

The topic that always seems to be avoided is having a proper launch area - how many beaches are really not suited to kitesurfing but used for it anyway? I keep hearing about one place in particular that is right next to an interstate highway - I don't see how you could ever make that safe... I'm sure there are others like it, and I'm sure there are guys who think they can handle the risk - but from what I've read so far, most serious accidents occur at launch, and there's no amount of skill that will protect you from making a mistake if you don't have an adequate buffer downwind.

Luck can get you by for a while, but (To quote Mr. Macdonald) "the only thing that will save your ass when the shit hits the fan is a big empty beach downwind." How many guys are deliberately putting themselves (and others) at risk by using a marginal or inadequate launch area?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 3:02 pm 
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Location: Madison, Wi. Cabrinha, Slingshot, Blade, Axis, Mystic, NP Surf.
Tom,

You're absolutely right. Newbies should have right of way most of the time. Sometimes though riders have no choice but to ride close to other riders. It's not ideal, but launch and landing situations sometimes dictate the riding situation.

One thing you and other newbies can do to help is if you're downwind and a rider is getting close, lower your kite so they can pass by you safely with thier kite overhead.

Good luck.


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