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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 10:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 87
Go4....

If its any use, I have the CB16m and am finding it VERY dissapointing, similar problems to yourself : sloppy bar, on/off power, zero turning on any bar setting other than full power, kite continuously trying to fly into the water, very heavy bar pressure and poor upwind performance. I've tried flying sheeting out and standing more upright as per Cabrinha suggestions but with little result
I have been flying for years and have R4 16m and Vegas 18m both of which fly much sweeter than my CB16m.
I suspect I might have a duff CB and have been talking to my local CB rep to have a try of a different CB16m (that the shop pro has flown and 'loves'). You might want to give another CB16m a go yourself.

My only other thought is that we've both been spoilt by the R4 and the flying of a CB16m just isn't as good.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 11:10 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 2:42 am
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Location: To my fan (*)(*)
consumer wrote:
i have yet to see someone do a boardoff or even a one-footer on a cb.

the way its setup, its really hard to keep the kite sheeted all the way in while turning it back down for the landing, AND do your board manuever.

wakestyle, whatever, you have both hands or one hand when passing ,it's not like its really any different with the bar setup.


I agree it's not the same thing. But in a few weeks time the powerlock should be on the market. It will allow you to hook in during a jump and free both your hands. A deadman combined with a board off will be easy and you'll float for ever.

P


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 11:25 pm 
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GoPro4Life and Captain Pugwash,

I am an absolute fan of North kites. I used to have the R4 (10, 14 and 20) as well as the R5 (10, 14 and 18). But I have to admit that I rode the XBow and was really impressed.

It took me a while (an hour or so) to get adjusted to the higher sensitivity of the bar (i.e. sheeting out a little bit will depower the kite much quicker than with the Rhinos). Also riding up wind requires a different technique (i.e. less edging and a bit more sheeting out). Once I had figured out these things the kite really impressed me.

I agree that there is room for further improvements (e.g. ball-system in the strut valves), but it's a pretty good start (especially from a safety perspective). Soon the powerlocks will be available allowing you to do more moves not requiring to leave your hand(s) on the bar or permanently hooking in.

But I have to come back to my usual line: "There is no such thing as THE BEST kite". Every rider will have it's own preference. I for example ride in often gusty conditions. So a kite with huge range and ability to instantly depower will make my riding much more comfortable.

P

P.S.: Let us know in which garbage can you're throwing yours, I'm sure there will be quite a queue to get it...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:29 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:25 pm
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Location: Vancouver
What is better? A Toyota or a Porsche? No matter which you believe, you will find a lot of people who disagree with you and they are perfectly entitled to their points of view.

I have 12m and 16m Crossbows, and I love 'em, but the stopper ball needs work. The bar is fine for me, but if it gets simpler in future generations without sacrificing performance, that will be better.

I like:
1. Stellar gust handling and wind range
2. New dimension to jumping
3. Safety
4. Great upwind and reserve power for super-fast reaches

If you aren't convinced about the upwind ability or the effectiveness of the sheeting range, here are my thoughts on the matter:

http://www.skypilotkiteboarding.com/mod ... 85&forum=7

Regards, James


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:49 am 
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Phillipp wrote:
But I have to come back to my usual line: "There is no such thing as THE BEST kite". Every rider will have it's own preference.


it's cliche as hell in almost every aspect, but god damn every time im riding it exponentially proves to be even more true.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 2:58 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 7:16 pm
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Like I have said in a past post, I believe the flat kite has potential. However, the bar system and pulley system make it a horrible kite to fly. Why would I want to have to ride in the powerlock the whole time to stay fully powered. These guys only take the advice of there team riders and not the "Normal" people who ride. Myself and a lot of other riders like to ride with there arms little extended but be fully powered. I always adjust my center lines so I can ride with my bar further out b/c it is more comfortable.

Its ironic that cabrinha has been making all these kite bar systems to be "More Safety Concious" and there have been a number of serious injuries, especially with people associated with the company, on cabrinha kites.

I guess I should just get to the point. Cabrinha should stop charging so much for a system that is so shity.....Cabrinha kites dont fly any better than other kites on the market. The only difference is that a crapy propietary bar comes with the kite. To use there system, you must use there bar, you must by from them, I am trying to brain wash you...I think you get my point.

Let me explain myslef so people dont think I have a certain agenda. I own cabrinha kites, north, naish, best, liquid force, viper, monkey, and wipika. I will use just about anything that flies worth a damn and doesnt require me to work any harder to have fun. I like inexpensive kites that fly "Well". My ability comes from my experience not from the gear Im riding. I will pull the same shitty tricks on any brand kite you give me.

Now, my final point....All kite companies suck accept for those who are trying to get us good gear at a good price. This whole crossbow thing just threw me over the edge. I have to shell out $1700 to find out something is a piece of shit. I am tired of it. I know what works. I bet if you put a pro on any tradtional arc kite that is from some cheap company, they will still school any of us any day of the week. Stop spending so much on advertising. Stop spending so much on the sponsored pros who half of couldnt even name who is sponsored by who. Cut out the middle man. Stop being so greedy. For god sake you having these things made in china. Best was a great company who offeres inexpensive kites that flew well. They where great until they started doing there product testing on the consumer. Allowing people to by kites that had not fully been proven. I see this happening to cabrinha. But my gripe still stands with all compaines who charge way too much for there kites.

Does everyone not undertsand wat is going on. This is a new sport that so many are trying to capatilze on and we are the suckers. Find the alternative, the company that has a kite that flies just as well but for half the price. Trust me I have tried them all , there is nothing wrong with them. Not to say I would never buy another kite from a big name brand, but not until they come down in price.

AAAAHHHHHH........I guess I feel better, I will let you know tomorrow after I hear all your responses.


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 Post subject: I love my 12m Crossbow
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:10 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:03 pm
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Location: Austin, TX
I'm a beginner, had a week's worth of lessons on normal Cabrinha kites. My instructors were raving about the Crossbow, I read around on the web and bought one. I like it much better than the C kites I learned on - safer, easier to relaunch, etc. I have no clue what you mean by it only having on and off, I find it has much more power range than the older kites.

As far as the price goes I think it's just that it's a small market. The price charged for the kite has to support R&D, tooling, marketing, etc., not just the materials and labor required to put a kite together, and since there are relatively few kiters there is a small base to amortize costs over.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:59 am 
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Location: Portland, Oregon
I can see where gp4life is coming from, but I really think the conclusion that bow kites will harm the kiteboarding industry is wrong.

I think with their intuitive nature and safety bow kites are great for getting people into the sport. There are a lot of things I would change. Price, complexity, feel, durability issues... but really they are the first kites to hopefully solve the biggest safety problem with kiteboarding: there is no "off" switch.

For anyone who lives in an area with appropriate wind and/or has the experience to be comfortable with their C kites, probably won't gain much from the bow kites... except maybe more company on the water.


Last edited by Dax on Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:12 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 18, 2004 5:49 am
Posts: 378
Location: The 'wick
Last thursday I was out with a 9 Crossbow and 2 friends, one has been riding since 2000, the other is a known kite mag journalist, they both tried going out on a traditional 9 and got blown off the water while I was comforatably riding in the largest waves I've seen in my life, having a blast. After seeing them on the beach I went in and traded off, which we continued for the rest of the afternoon. After coming in both remarked "That kite is so fucking rad". It was 35-over 40 mph and comfortably riding a 9 like it was a 12 in steady 20. Earlier in the week I was out on the same kite and board lit in 20ish conditions and was the smallest kite on the water, even though I'm the biggest guy.

If you don't like it fine, there are dozens others that are in line for one behind you.

Dax, you forgot a point: waves. There is nothing like this kite in waves.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:12 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 5:08 am
Posts: 40
Location: South Florida
Quickly, tonight I'm too impatient. I have the 16 Xbow.
1. When I fuckup, it stays flying when other C kites would definitely be falling out of the sky.
2. I'm jumping higher w/ my Xbow then with any of my Naish V4's or Rage II's. NO COMMENT.
3. Hang time IS..... FREEKING... IN.....INCREDIBLE!!!! You could read a book. The other day I laughed while in the air because I heard the water dripping off me hitting the water below.
4. The bar pressure is the same as any of my other MID ASPECT kites***
5. It is very unfortunate people are caught up on this "pull the bar all the way in shit". I'm usually riding w/ the bar halfway in...Moderate pressure. If you are pulling the bar all the way in; your bows not tuned. If you get caught up in the notion about shorting the knots on your pig tails; you might as well get rid of the kite cause it isn’t gonna fly right. The correct lengths have been tested way more then us fiddling with um on the beach. OK...I added ONE KNOT 1.5" up on the outside lines if the winds are real light.
***IMO I bet most the posts about all this bar pressure are from people who normally fly HIGH ASPECT KITES (which have next to no bar press.) I have “Kite Elbowâ€


Last edited by jdog on Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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