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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:42 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 7:49 am
Posts: 552
Pump me up wrote:
Ram airs simply aren't safe. They are inferior to inflatables aerodynamically AND in safety terms.

8: Safety
- Inflatables are safer than ram airs because
-- Downwind launches are bloody SCARY for a beginner
-- Rams deform, twist, wineglass, explode in the middle of the power zone etc when they are downwind of obstacles, in rotors, and in VERY gusty conditions. This is VERY dangerous. Some of the most frightening kitemares ever witnessed have involved ram users walking along beaches in cross-offshore conditions - their kites have been virtually uncontrollable and have endangered both the rider and other beach users.
-- Wind dropouts and gear failure
--- You will invariably experience a few gear failures (eg broken lines) and COMPLETE wind dropouts every year. If you are a fair way offshore, you can use the inflatable as a "sail" to get back in. Alternatively you can use the inflatable structure to support your weight.
--- All ram airs become hopelessly waterlogged after 45 minutes - unlaunchable and certainly unable to support your body weight.
-- Surf conditions
---While it is always a gamble if your kite gets caught by a wave, at least you've got a fighting chance if it is an inflatable. If it is a ram air, it's all over.
-- Bridle tangles and failures - Scary and expensive (US $500 plus) (eg see the thread titled "Flysurfer Warrior Exploding:" phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=4612 )


PMU,

Your rant is so old and tired :baby: Get real. No one listens to you anymore. You have not had a post worth a damn in over 5 years.


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:14 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 20, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 933
Location: rhode island
Quote:
8: Safety according to PMU
- Inflatables are safer than ram airs because ....blah,blah,blah.....


Greats news!
I for one feel the matter is settled.

PMUs rant is so welll documented that one only needs to refer to them by number.
Very similar to the 10 Commandments.

Jake, its quite obvious (as i am the master) that you have violated foil foible #8
I dont know how i could have missed that in my first response.

Had you only broken rule #6 or #3.5 , you'd still be sippin pina coladas on the beach, kite in hand.

oh well.
-bill
:)


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:36 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 19, 2004 5:58 pm
Posts: 320
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
Toby,

While PMU has a right to his opinions and his claim to being the court jester, false claims about safety are no laughing matter. Maybe it's time to start deleting these standard rants until he can present some opinions that may be of some use to readers of this forum (or at least PM him and ask him to consider safety statements more sensitive than the rest).

Cheers,

Gideon


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:21 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:10 pm
Posts: 398
Location: netherlands
No discrimination or insulting on matters of race,religion,gender.nationality or kite-type or brand,heck no discussion whatsoever on this Forum.
Just peacefull exchange of usefull information,interaction between understanding, loving and respectfull individuals is what we're after :chorus:


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:33 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 3:59 am
Posts: 868
Location: Upper Padre . . . . --> Oleander
I kind of hope the old troll will still be hyperlinking this post in 2014.
Jake


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:16 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 1771
Location: Miami @ 6" Flat Butter!
All I can say sh!t can happen in kitesurfing with either foil or inflatable.
But it happened to me also but in a different way.

About 2 weeks ago I launched my 15m Speed2 in a 13 -15 mph winds.
I went out about 2 miles to gain up-wind so I could go with one tack
to the other launching site and where everybody rides.
And you know what?
Suddenly and unexpectedly a high wind gust came through and it virtually
ripped me off my board and 10 feet in the air loosing it.
Meanwhile focusing where the hell the board is falling in the chops
suddenly to realize I started being towed under after wipe out,
with lines twisted and one of the backline tangled on to the spreader bar. Aaaach….
After some time first I was able to free-up my spreader bar under the water
and undo the line twists but it was very difficult to reverse relaunch the soaked kite
without the resistance of the board which I lost.
After I just flew it a little to dry it, in a hope I’ll be able to find the board,
but I couldn’t find it for 45 minutes.
Than I almost gave it up in a middle of nowhere and do a body drag back to the shore,
when a boat came nearby so I blew my whistle and waved down.
Even the boat had problem finding it but I’m glad I ended up all right.

I had another kitemare also about 6 months ago with a virtually new 8m P3.
It was kind of stupid it's not the kite because I went out too far in a light side shore wind,
when I lost all the wind and the kite landed on the water.
I was trying to keep the lines tight so I could relaunch if the wind comes back,
while trying to swim back to the shore.
Than half way I partially rapped up the lines and tried to adjust the kite
so it would it would pull me back to the shore which did.
But the big problem by the time I got back to the shore the lines and bridals
tangled up very bad I’ve never seen before.
I tried to undo it couple of time but no success.
Atually probably wouldn't take much more to undoo the spaghetti factor,
but I just don't want to deal with it any more.
If I any of you would give a reasonable offer for the 8m P3
I would let it go, because I’d like to replace with the coming P4.

DrLightWind


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:34 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:36 pm
Posts: 178
Location: Australia
I don't know why you all keep getting so worked up about PMU's posts. The solution is really simple and easy... Just Click Here and it will add PMU to your Ignore list. So when he dribbles at the chin this is all you will see;

Image

Regards,

.Joel


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:54 pm 
DrLightWind wrote:
All I can say sh!t can happen in kitesurfing with either foil or inflatable.
But it happened to me also but in a different way.

About 2 weeks ago I launched my 15m Speed2 in a 13 -15 mph winds.
I went out about 2 miles to gain up-wind so I could go with one tack
to the other launching site and where everybody rides.
And you know what?
Suddenly and unexpectedly a high wind gust came through and it virtually
ripped me off my board and 10 feet in the air loosing it.
Meanwhile focusing where the hell the board is falling in the chops
suddenly to realize I started being towed under after wipe out,
with lines twisted and one of the backline tangled on to the spreader bar. Aaaach….
After some time first I was able to free-up my spreader bar under the water
and undo the line twists but it was very difficult to reverse relaunch the soaked kite
without the resistance of the board which I lost.
After I just flew it a little to dry it, in a hope I’ll be able to find the board,
but I couldn’t find it for 45 minutes.
Than I almost gave it up in a middle of nowhere and do a body drag back to the shore,
when a boat came nearby so I blew my whistle and waved down.
Even the boat had problem finding it but I’m glad I ended up all right.

I had another kitemare also about 6 months ago with a virtually new 8m P3.
It was kind of stupid it's not the kite because I went out too far in a light side shore wind,
when I lost all the wind and the kite landed on the water.
I was trying to keep the lines tight so I could relaunch if the wind comes back,
while trying to swim back to the shore.
Than half way I partially rapped up the lines and tried to adjust the kite
so it would it would pull me back to the shore which did.
But the big problem by the time I got back to the shore the lines and bridals
tangled up very bad I’ve never seen before.
I tried to undo it couple of time but no success.
Atually probably wouldn't take much more to undoo the spaghetti factor,
but I just don't want to deal with it any more.
If I any of you would give a reasonable offer for the 8m P3
I would let it go, because I’d like to replace with the coming P4.

DrLightWind



US $1 :roll: :roll: :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: My Foil Kite Sunk!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:18 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:23 am
Posts: 3332
Location: The United Mistakes of America
jakemooremd wrote:
Well after hundreds of successful and often times improbable water relaunches I lost my 5 meter foil kite to a wave. The kite luffed and bowtied so I sat there 3/4 mi from shore waiting patiently for it to sort itself out as it always has done but it never happened. Finally I gave up and started wrapping the lines around the bar to pack it down but as it did I started drifting through the impact zone so I had to let it go. We had shoulder high peeling waves that would have munched any kite and the crashes were starting to pull it. I just calmly bodysurfed back in with my board and waited for my kite but it never came. A few friends sailed out to check on it but there were no sightings. I rigged another kite and didn't find it either but did have a good session. Who knows? Maybe the water inside the kite really is heavier than on the outside.

Thanks for the people who checked up on me and didn't get tangled in the bridle.

Jake


Not the first kite (any brand) to fail to relaunch - and not the first kite to die passing through the wave zone. Too bad you don't have the shredded carcass as a trophy though...


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