Why inflatables on the snow??!!

[scklandl]

here's something I never got:

people say foils are great because you just wrap up the bar and put it in the kite. no disconnecting the lines... YOU CAN DO this with an inflato!!! nothings stopping you, its actually easier with an inflato as the bridles (if any) are much less complicated.

seriously people WTF?

any then there's the performance factor... Even my 60+ year old friend thinks that foils don't provide him with as much performance as LEI. He rides his foil at times , loves it for Cadillac cruising, but knows its behind the game in performance.

dont mention Chasta, he's a paid rider for a company that has it's bias towards foils, he dont count.

[sandyisland]

K IMO foils suck water /snow... on snow iv seen the best(and rode) , newest, latest greatest ect foils taco in shit wind while im getting on with it on a tube.... sure its fine if its blowing nothing or your riding steady light wind or and ya want to mow the lawn and dangle around...... with one pump no big deal on set up. Tubes can give ya G's when ya loop.... every foil i have looped is so dull .... flame on foil lovers

[bay surfer]

A Tuned open cell foil is a work of art, most dont know how to tune. My kites fly as good or better than tubes till they get bigger than 8m, then they are just too slow. I ride big tubes even through its a pain to pump big tube . Big and small close cell foil have = or better performance than tubes but you pay lots of $$$$$ for said performance and they are not as durable as tubes or opencell foils ,,,,,,ya ya what happens if you slam the leading edge on a tube..... I hate to say this in cold weather they seldom pop,,,,,, Close cell foils on the other hand go POW

[FredBGG]

dont mention Chasta, he's a paid rider for a company that has it's bias towards foils, he dont count.

What bull shit.... look Ozone makes great kites' both Foils and LEIs. Chasta could pick what he wants and Ozone would be happy.

Incidently have you ever wondered why paragliders arn't LEIs

[voodoospirit]

if u have a problem with a kite, 90% of the time, the problem comes from the rider...
peeps r trying to ride a C-shape kite like they would ride their bows or the opposite...
they dont want to adapt themselves to the kite..

all i know is when i see a rider crying over a kite (or flaming it), i know that the rider has a huge lack of adaptation.

i ride mainly close cells kites (PL and FS), i ride also C-shape LEI and SLE/bows from time to time, i almost never ride open cell foils ( i don t trekk much so i don t need them for my use), i adapt my style for each kite cause if i try to ride a Torch like i would ride a switchblade3, i would say: bahhh the SB3 sucks sooo much...

learn and adapt and stop sticking with that close minded mentality..

u can do pretty much everything with an open cell foil ( but on water) , i hardly ever see people do more than 2 kiteloop in one jump on flat areas , newschooles moves r landed on every type of kites
i even saw newschooles moves with a speed².....sooooo LEI performance argument makes me smile LOL

[PBKiteboarding]

When the wind is 6mph and you still want to snowkite, a 19m will do... all bigger kites will turn slower, but use them for their power and use your body to turn faster and have fun... I find this fun even in the light stuff... Try everything LEI and Closed, Open Cell Foils and figure out what you like. You never know till you have the choice to pick one or the other... People are different.
A few vids to show a mix of sizes 19m. 12m, 4m. Fun in all winds.

Flysurfer Silver Arrow 19m in a bout 6mph



12m Speed 12m



The when the wind is stronger flip a little 4m around turns and moves fast... 4 Ozone Access

[Cortex]

I *really* hate when people write "foils are this, and foils are that". What foil? You can't bring all of the different types/brands/models under one label and say that they lack in performance, or have a small depower-range etc.
Foils are very, very different from each other. Don't you guys realize that stating "foil" is like if you'd use the term "LEI" to represent all the inflatos in the market.

I.e: "Hey, know what? I rode a LEI back in 2001... so all those LEI's suck compared to the latest and greatest foils".

Just doesn't work that way. Which in the LEI-case most people realize and therefore know that a BOW, hybrid and C are very different kites aimed at very different styles/customers.

The same also is equally (or even more so) true for "foils". First of all, there is in *no way* you can compare a "foil" of any kind, that has 2-3 years on its back, to a brand new high-depower one from a good brand.
And to be completely honest I'd list only 3 brands that have any sort of clue on how to build a modern foil... and only one of them (in my opinion) is really pushing the boundaries forward on foil-technology.

If you want solid freestyle performance from a foil you should try a Flysurfer Psycho4. I currently have a love affair with the P4 8.
It loops sooooo nicely and is really fast, even compared to the faster hybrids on the market.
I also ride (and own) a bunch of hybrids. The Mayhem X is an extremely nice kite (and super-fast, significantly faster turning/looping then most kites on the market) and a MX 9 is a tad faster then the P4 8 in the turns... but on the other hand the P4 provides more power per sqm. Besides those two differences they share a lot of good qualities.
Although I like the Mayhems very much there just is no way I'd use the hybrids on snow over my P4's (and Speed2's in light wind).... or when need to travel light.... or when I need to launch and land solo... or when I need to launch from a boat.

That said, the Mayhem's work really good on snow too, but the extra hassle with pumping and serious wear on the LE on ice etc makes the P4 a so much better option for snow.

So I'd say that performance-wise there isn't any reason for choosing one or the other (as long as you choose the right model of kite for your riding).

When it comes to *price* it is another thing though...

[kenny KAF]

it really makes me laugh to see this war foil/inflato going back again. Not that I will defend the foils one more time but because it reminds me that now LEI riders are also getting in war between them with the C/bow/hybrid fight. You know what LEI riders? Keep discussing which of those inflatos are the best and we (foil lovers) will keep on riding what we want.

[PBKiteboarding]

Don't forget, we're all flying "KITES" and getting a rush... Keep learning and find out more info from people who know a variety too... Forums can be great to open your mind myself I ride Closed cell foils, Open cell, C kites and SLE's...

Back on an inflatable SLE here, more fun: but don't like to pump it in winter if i don't need it to float and cringe to see it drag on a chunky ice snow day... I do pro kite repair, so I know the damage and time involved... save this baby for water...



If it weren't for Kiteforum I wouldn't have been kiting this day... unless I had this 19m Silver Arrow for example:
Summer light winds used to be very frustrating, missing to many nice days. So I use what works and get me out there. With the sport getting more popular you can kite on days when no one else can stay upwind... cuts down on kite traffic... Use what works for you and fit your style and budget.

[FredBGG]

Here is an intresting video that shows one great aspect of foils for snow kiting.

Your own personal ski lift into the wilderness.

Kite up to the summit... pack the kite in a beat....into a tiny back pack..
ski down with the kite in a back pack to another location....
re setup the kite and snow kite for a while...
Kite back up the mountain... ski back home.... no pump required

[kiteforumtv]http://www.kiteforum.tv/video/Freeridin ... iends.html[/kiteforumtv]