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 Post subject: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 10:51 pm 
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Hi guys,

I would like to present KiteRegs published in Poland a week ago.
Majority of Polish kitesurfing schools do their training according to IKO guidelines.
There is no kitesurfing organization or association in our country.
However our society tries to pay a lot of attention towards safety.
We felt that there is a lack of detailed information about rights of way and any kind of guide showing how to behaviour on the water in various cases.
This concern becomes more important with increasing amount of new kitesurfers. It took almost one year of interesting discussions on www.kiteforum.pl.
I spent hundreds hours surfing internet instead waves :( I hope it was worth it.

Finally we have been able to publish a booklet and a poster.
Image

The idea is simple: we want to post special info boards (with KiteRegs’ poster) among popular Polish spots and promote the KiteRegs as much as possible.
The book will be given to the trainees by schools. Some equipment dealers have already decided to attach the book to sold by them gear.

The KiteRegs are available on internet:
http://www.kiteteam.pl/kodeks.html (for English version click the Union Jack in the bottom-right corner located on the picture of the book cover).
The book is on sale in some kitesurfing shops in Poland or by on-line bookseller
http://www.sporty.pl/index.php?s=karta&id=9834

Rules were translated only in English due to a simple lack of time.
A poster which is enclosed to the book contains additionally German description of all drawings.
The poster (size A3) attached to the book looks like this:
Image

I would appreciate if you answer following questions:

1. What do you think about presented KiteRegs?
2. How do you like the project to promote KiteRegs?
3. Would you like to see a board with KiteRegs and additional info for observers on your spots?
4. Do you think is worth to translate it on other languages?

If anybody is interesting in this idea contact me on bracuru@interia.pl please.


Last edited by BraCuru on Thu Jun 04, 2009 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 8:18 am 
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Location: Kailua, Hawaii, currently riding EH and OR kites (2013 Razor rocks!)
Excellent sign! Very clear and easy to understand. Consistent with normal rules of sailing, and it covers the special situations unique to kiting.

Excellent, excellent sign. How can we get one of the posters? It would be good to give to our local Department of Land and Natural Resouces as a suggestion for a general publication for kiting rules. Is it copyrighted? You should look into selling laminated versions of the posters to simplify mass distribution. Perhaps a major kite manufacturer could get behind the mass distribution as a public service?

For our beach situation, it would be good to include Japanese as an additional language.

It would be super if all the kite shops had this poster displayed in their store to show a unanimity of support for a common set of rules/etiquette in kiting. Each kiting forum should include this poster somewhere on their site as a static posting to inform new comers of the common rules of etiquette and safety.

Bravo! :bravo: :clap:


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 9:13 am 
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When will you people realize that COREGS and international sailing rules adopted for yachts do not work with crowded kitesurfing locations. It confuses beginners as only complete a$$holes use the Starboard tack rule.

How about some guidlines like some dude is coming into the flat water slick and looks like he wants to bust a move, a rider that is potentially in the way should do his/her best to get the f$ck out of the way. It's about god damn courtesy and "doing unto other as you would like them to do unto you" or so the Bible says.

Other useful information would be telling beginners that it's incredible annoying when you are encountering someone head on to stop and turn around in that you will be going slow and a little down wind of the guy and hence totally f&cking up his ride. This is practicle real world advice and not some pointless yachting rules that make sense only on paper.

Waves, chop, different skill levels, different kite sizes, riding styles/preference, etc. make it just too F&cking complicated to summarize up in some stupid Starboard tack rule and other bullsh1t.

Beginners should do their best to stay the F$ck out of the way because they are a pain in the a$$. Advanced riders should do their best to give beginners some space and leniency because they have no F$cking control.

Unless you are a complete f$cking a$$hole, take the starboard tack rule and shove it up your a$$.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 9:30 am 
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partly right, Satan.

If there is a specific perfect flat water jump area, way should be give to the one who loads up for jumping there, I agree.

But in normal riding areas, where you just ride to go upwind, starboard makes sense to make sure it does not become a mess.

And please, show a bit more respect towards other people who put a lot of work into this when choosing your words.

I would also like to discuss this picture:

Image

Looking at the wind, I would assume the kiter in the wave will ride the wave and ride further downwind, so it does not make sense that the red kiter goes downwind of the wave kiter!
Just make the red kiter jibe away from the wave kiter at all, but the downwind should be given to the wave kiter.

Otherwise, great work! :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 10:23 am 
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Toby, it's good to see you are coming around some on my ideas although I'll never expect you to appreciate my ways.

I do applaud their grass-roots approach and guys working to make their own kite-spot better. It will never come from IKO/IKA/WKO/IGKA/etc. It was nice of them to share their work. There is room for improvement but it's better then the crap the IKO teaches. These rules get softer and less stringent and more kitesurf friendly with every new version.

The main idea needs to be changed from "right of way" to "general rules of curtsey". No right of way rules are ever going to prevent collisions between kitesurfers, but we can draft some guidelines that help people understand the dynamics of kitesurfing traffic. We're kitesurfers. It's about peace, freedom and understanding not about erecting some fascist state where no one has any fun.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 10:56 am 
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Location: europe
the CNK (FFVL) in france have the same signs panel. with french/english explanations if needed.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 3:23 pm 
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Windrider - Thanks for appreciation and your ideas.
I am trying to promote KiteRegs in Poland just by KS shops, schools and dealers. I am waiting for answer from Nobile. If positive we would see the promotion running on a fast track.

The book and the poster are copyrighted. Tomorrow I will speak to the publisher to get more details.
I believe that it would not be a problem to publish the book in any language in Poland and ship it around the globe. The proper translations may take extra time and money.
I published it from my private money and I do not want to spent more for unnecessary translations. I would go for it only for serious orders (including Japanese :o ) – let’s say more than 500 books.
The cost of a single booklet with the inserted poster including shipping should not be higher than 5€ if ordered in reasonable amounts.
The production of big info boards is a more complicated matter. It is rather expensive staff and I would prefer to send a pdf file to persons interesting to produce it at own place.
A symbolic fare for a declared amount of produced boards would make it somehow controllable and fair.
I can confirm that the booklet and the poster look much better in reality than on the picture. It was published on a high quality paper with varnished covers.
Everybody who saw it was well impressed :P

Anyway I would appreciate if you like the idea please speak to your friends on spots, shop and schools owners about this project. If you are in touch with gear manufactures than ask them if they would be interested to promote KiteRegs

Toby – you are right. I have spent hours watching for any mistake and have missed it.
Shame on me :-? :oops: :-?
I will remove the red downwind part of the arrow on next issues. Let’s say it presents waves give-way rule in symbolic way now - thanks :thumb:

Satan, - I am afraid but it looks you did not read these rules. Please click this:
http://www.kiteteam.pl/index.php?option ... &Itemid=75

..and check Rule5 which states:

Rule 5 – Multiperson meeting (Rule 4 (Starboard-tack) is not applicable)
5.1. The most upwind rider raises his/her kite to the highest point and the most downwind rider lowers his/her kite to the lowest point. Other riders passing between the riders at the extremes set their kites in intermediate positions in order to avoid kite tangling.
5.2. It is recommended that meetings involving more than two riders be avoided whenever possible.


And comments to this rule:

Rule 5. The multiperson meetings increase the risk of collisions and should be avoided. It concerns especially beginners. ...
....For example: the starboard tack rider meets with two port tack riders kiting in parallel direction, 10 meters apart. The upwind port rider is on the collision course with the starboard one. If he complies with Rule 4 he should go downwind to give way to the starboard one. But he cannot do this, because he simultaneously has to give way to the downwind rider who for instance additionally might be overtaken.

Taking into account the possible effects of a collision during these meetings, the special principle has been created. This principle distinguishes kitesurfing from the other water sports. During meetings involving more than two riders no one is privileged, but each must respond as a give-way rider! It means that everybody has to take an avoiding action once he realises that such meeting is going to take place. The most common action performed is a small course alternation and setting the kite in a way to avoid tangling.

In simple words: Starboard-tack rule does not exist if you meet with two or more kitesurfers! Your words!!!!

I agree with you that we are different than yachts, windsurfers etc. Please read this:

These Rules are based on ColRegs, state rules, sailing and windsurfing regulations. Had not kitesurfing been different from the sailing, it would be the simplest way just to adopt the sailing regulations. Such a situation happened when windsurfing appeared on the water scene. However, a kitesurfer differs from a yacht, a motor boat or even a windsurfer – at first glance we see a completely new design of propulsion. The kitesurfer sails on a small, light weight board weighing only 3 kg and the source of the propulsion is a kite flying 30 meters away with its square surface of up to 20 m2. When the kite flies above water it occupies exactly the same width as a container vessel of length of 250 meters! At the same time, the manoeuvrability of advanced rider is comparable with a jet-ski. On top of that some of us are able, like a hydroplane, to jump into air on 10-15 meter levels and finally land 100 meters below. We are able to become airborne for 10 seconds or more. Imagine that a container vessel, with manoeuvrability and speed of a jet-ski and ability to take off, is given into the hands of youngster who has just finished a few hours of a kitesurfing course. It is the highest concern of all of us that even such an inexperienced person will ride safely, obeying clearly explained and standardized rules.
The creation of three exceptions to the yachting rules is caused by the otherness of kitesurfing to other water sports and risk minimizing. The author hopes that they will be accepted by all water users. The first exception refers to the possibility of reducing speed by the stand-on rider while overtaking. The second exception concerns meetings of more than two riders, during which there is no stand-on rider. The third difference is in the introduction of the precise length of power-driven crafts, whom we give the way to. Detailed explanations were given in the comments to the relevant rules.


It took almost one year to write these rules and comments to them. I believe the rules and the poster proposed by me are clearer and precise than anything till now. But if you have a better proposals please do not hesitate and create a kitesurfing bible spreading peace, freedom and understanding on the water like this (Poland, Hel Peninsula where Nobile boards are tested):
Image
(taken from:http://www.kiteforum.pl/forum/viewtopic ... highlight=)

By the way the bible is based on rules too :D


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 4:02 pm 
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"What we have here is a failure to communicate"

...............................................................................Cool Hand Luke

"Beep" = "Get out of my way"
"Beep, Beep" = "Get the F@#K out of my way"
"Beep, Beep,Beep" = "God D@#M it, get the F@#k out of my way...I am going to 'bust a move'!"


Attachments:
kf- beep beep1.JPG
kf- beep beep1.JPG [ 122.57 KIB | Viewed 3105 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 5:34 pm 
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kitezilla wrote:
"Beep" = "Get out of my way"
"Beep, Beep" = "Get the F@#K out of my way"
"Beep, Beep,Beep" = "God D@#M it, get the F@#k out of my way...I am going to 'bust a move'!"


Excellent :lol: :lol: :lol: and simple: just three beeping rules :D


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 Post subject: Re: Kite Regulations (KiteRegs) - rights of way
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 5:49 pm 
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Satan: I am sure we do agree in many things...but not all ;-) But that is fine with me...otherwise I would love your girlfriend too :wink:

BraCuru: always happy when I can help!

The picture above is amazing...is that a normal day in Hel or during an event?


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