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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse SURGE
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:23 am 
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Location: uranus
felixeclipse wrote:

Majority of people that tried the 7m and 9m today noticed that was -

-Very stable.

-Has a lot of power for its size.

-Fly's forward and sits in a real sweet spot for wake and wave riding.



Really? lol, I thought you might say it was sh#t :) .

p.s. I thought I read a post from Dimitri himself that said they weren't making a C kite because no one wants them except the sponsored riders who dont pay for their gear anyway....


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:20 pm 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
Hello guys,
As you can see from Felix's pictures we are introducing you the new revolutionary C kite from ECLIPSE KITES. Let me tell you more about the SURGE.
The Surge is a come back from where it all began. This is not your daddy's C kite!!! We are happy to introduce you the new generation of C kite. The SURGE, a 4 line kite was designed by Felix Pivec and Bill Hansen. We wanted to bring you the next generation of ultimate C kite performance. So if you are a Pro rider or a person who is looking for a rush, then the SURGE will be your choice for these big power moves and powerfull Kiteloops. :o
Don’t let this kite fool you, this C kite offers the true performance all freestylers and wave riders desire while rivaling the de-power and safety of today's SLE kites.
This will come in 4 different colors. So far you have seen the White/Black/Red, but we have 3 more colors coming up.

The reason we did not get into C kites earlier was because of the demand but as you can see more and more people are asking for a C kite. So we want to have a company that can deliver any type of kites customers are looking for. So here we go.


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:40 pm 
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Location: Perth, Australia
Hey Guys,

Can somebody clarify the two types of kites, the one's that sit deep in the window and the one's that fly forward in regards to surfing with a kite. eg your preferences between the two. I don't know if this makes sense!

I think the guys that go back hand would prefer the forward window types and the forehand guys the deeper flying kites.

Felix maybe you can comment on your preferences and why.

Cheers
Rich :bye: a


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:34 pm 
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Posts: 243
I flew fixed loop for many years, even when the chicken loop became popular back in the old Naish AR5 days. In fact I didn't learn to fly using a chicken loop until the SLE kites came out. What I wanted back in the C-kite days was a kite that would fly forward in the window, but would also have a nice consistent pull. Back then it seemed like you had three choices in terms of kite performance. You could have a high aspect kite that would fly forward in the window, but they did not offer a good consistent pull, and were more prone to an on/off type of power. They did offer better jumping, better upwind ability and usually had lighter bar pressure. Then you had the lower aspect C-kites that would hang back in the window with a more consistent pull, but the trade off was more bar pressure, less upwind ability, and less jumping height. For me I was always looking for a C-kite that would fly forward in the window, but would not shoot past the edge so easily as to give the on/off type of power. It's a delicate balance to get a kite to fly right in that narrow zone at the edge of the window without flying too far forward or dropping too far back. The best compromise back then was a medium aspect kite that was sort of a compromise between the high aspect kites and the low aspect kites.

I would be interested in hearing how the Surge is able to depower like an SLE? Does it have a front or rear bridle, or is it a direct pigtail to kite connection? If so how is the increased (SLE type) of depower achieved? Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:44 pm 
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>>The surge sits in the sweet spot for maximum efficiency.

'maximum efficiency' - not even sure what that means. i can tell you what you, felix, and most wave C kiters on this forum already know; wake style kiters want grunt. wave style kiters want smooth power transitions and a forward flying kite. if you are going to build a niche product you pretty much have to choose one or the other to really nail it..

honestly don't believe the de-power part of the story. i'm sure it will have plenty of de-power if you fly it right. legions of sle kiters are used to pushing their arms out to turn off the kite. C kites don't work that way. the kite may be good, but you are shooting yourself in the foot if you claim de-power as a feature.

i can restart a C in just about anything. when i lend my C out to a curious friend, they get washed. selling this kite as if it has a quick restart feature is probably a mistake as well.

in a nutshell; this kite is a niche product for people who don't really give a fuk about restarting with the flick of a wrist or '75% of de-power of the thruster'. call it what it is and you'll probably go further with it. anyways.. maybe you're right and i'm wrong. what do i know. i just like to kite. will def try the kite in the smaller sizes if i get a chance. congrads on the kite.


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 9:33 pm 
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Location: Nassau,Bahamas
eastcoastkite wrote:
This is a kite we spent allot of time on, refining it and making sure it would take C kites to a new level of performance. What I can say is I have tested every other C kite on the market and the Surge blows them out of the water in every aspect without question.

The kite is a true 4 line C kite- no bridals. We provide a 5th line attachment point for riders that like the extra safety and relaunch - but you dont need it- the kite was not designed for a 5th line.

We will have an 11m.

The 9m makes the power of a traditional 11m so keep that in mind. The kite is very fast and features a very small LE- new construction style to avoid any stability issues that usually result from a small LE. The surge sits in the sweet spot for maximum efficiency.

The surge does not relaunch as easy as an SLE but it does have a very similar range and I would say about 75% of de-power of the thruster. So its a kite that can work for all ridders.

Felix is working on a video and some more pics to show the performance.


are these 2010 or 2011 kites? when do you, " Think!" they will hit the streets? how much the 11m complete will cost? what about the bar how will that look ?
I have the 9 Kima and 09 16m Thruster would love to have a 11m C kite to make up the quiver(if the price is right ;) )


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 9:49 pm 
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does it relaunch as well as other c kites out now (torch and fuel?)
or like the older ones??
I got a fuel 09 and it relaunches easier than some sle's I have tried.....
(You do have to pull on the rope though, not "auto")

Like to see some video:

Relaunch (deep water, board off)

Loops/ sent jump

Wave riding

Pop

Thanks to you guys for building it, hope it works out well!

And some questions:
The Surge wingtip tip looks like it has an inflated bladder in it, but not continuous with the LE, and probably not rigidly attached to it.
Is this the case?
Does it hinge about like an old style battened wingtip?
Does it have a batten in it also for stiffness?
Why?
Enlighten us....


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 10:49 pm 
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Location: World (KF Admin)
here is the official news from Eclipse:

http://www.kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2358262

and read also this, Bill Hansen is joining Eclipse Kites!

http://www.kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2358258


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:59 pm 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
Whaoo... so many questions. :oops:
Ok let me see if I can answer most of these questions. Felix I am going to need some of your help also if I miss something.

Ok, the answer in YES for everything :D

Let's be serious. :thumb:
The SURGE was designed more for advance riders. So we tested it on a normal bar with no much depower like it use to be 5 years ago and it worked excellent. But then I put our 2009 bar on it to see if we could fly it on the same bar. We were very surprised of its performance and could not believe how well it was de-powering. Now lets say that the SLE kites can depower at least 90% of the power of the kite. The SURGE can depower at least 75% of the power of the kite. A normal C will depower probably from 30 to 60% depending of the bar and what kind of system you have.
So in few words, the SURGE will be able to de-power more then a normal C kite for sure.

Concerning a kite that does everything. I strongly believe that you can't have a kite that does everything very good, same thing with a board. And also it depends on what kind of rider you are. Different riders have different style and like different kites for different conditions.
For example, Felix loves the C kite for the wave, he also loves the THRUSTER for the waves because they go further forward into the window compare to the KIMA. But he also enjoy the KIMA in the waves. It is just a different style. Felix never left the C kite. He always beleived in them, so he got use to ride C kites.
Me on the other hand, I love the KIMA for the waves compare to the THRUSTER and the C kite. I love the THRUSTER for the hang time and love the C kite for power moves and big mega loops. So it depends what you are looking for. But of course you can use the C kite or the THRUSTER for everything you want to kite in. It just depends of what you are use to.

The SURGE will be released in September. Then the other kites will follow.

Felix and I will work on some videos so you can see how it flies and how it de-powers and how it relaunches.

I don't want to make this too long but I hope you can understand what I am talking about.


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 Post subject: Re: Eclipse Surge
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2009 12:21 am 
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Dimitri wrote:
Whaoo... so many questions. :oops:
Ok let me see if I can answer most of these questions. Felix I am going to need some of your help also if I miss something.

Ok, the answer in YES for everything :D

Let's be serious. :thumb:
The SURGE was designed more for advance riders. So we tested it on a normal bar with no much depower like it use to be 5 years ago and it worked excellent. But then I put our 2009 bar on it to see if we could fly it on the same bar. We were very surprised of its performance and could not believe how well it was de-powering. Now lets say that the SLE kites can depower at least 90% of the power of the kite. The SURGE can depower at least 75% of the power of the kite. A normal C will depower probably from 30 to 60% depending of the bar and what kind of system you have.
So in few words, the SURGE will be able to de-power more then a normal C kite for sure.

Concerning a kite that does everything. I strongly believe that you can't have a kite that does everything very good, same thing with a board. And also it depends on what kind of rider you are. Different riders have different style and like different kites for different conditions.
For example, Felix loves the C kite for the wave, he also loves the THRUSTER for the waves because they go further forward into the window compare to the KIMA. But he also enjoy the KIMA in the waves. It is just a different style. Felix never left the C kite. He always beleived in them, so he got use to ride C kites.
Me on the other hand, I love the KIMA for the waves compare to the THRUSTER and the C kite. I love the THRUSTER for the hang time and love the C kite for power moves and big mega loops. So it depends what you are looking for. But of course you can use the C kite or the THRUSTER for everything you want to kite in. It just depends of what you are use to.

The SURGE will be released in September. Then the other kites will follow.

Felix and I will work on some videos so you can see how it flies and how it de-powers and how it relaunches.

I don't want to make this too long but I hope you can understand what I am talking about.


how much the 11m complete will cost?


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