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 Post subject: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:56 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 1:56 pm
Posts: 67
Hey all =)

I'm up on my board now but having a bit of difficulty keeping going. I watch people, they swoop the kite, get up on the board n then "park" their kite n off they go....

I keep loosing power for what ever reason. I get up, fly along a bit n then just sink! Most people i spoke to that are learning have the same problem, so obviously quite a popular problem among learners..

What made it "click" for you guys? Any advice, or whatever greatly appreciated.

Thanks... =)


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:15 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 6:56 am
Posts: 3751
Location: Kailua, Hawaii, currently riding EH and OR kites (2013 Razor rocks!)
One thing that's common in learning is that you want to start cutting upwind before you really even get on a plane. That's like putting on the parking brake when trying to engage the clutch in first gear..... (hmmm.. might be an anachronism there... do you know how to drive a manual transmission... no matter.... whatever...)

If you dive the kite and then start trying to edge right away, your board won't have enough speed to be on a plane, so... you'll just sink. Keep your board pointed downwind until you've completed the down stroke AND the upstroke... then try to aim your board a little more across the wind. You have to have anough speed to plane before trying to cut across the wind.


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:54 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 11:35 am
Posts: 1687
Just practise. There's probably no specific thing that you're doing wrong that can be fixed with a quick comment. Chances are you're doing everything wrong. :wink:

A friend who is a very high level, expert surfer, sailor, paraglider, skier, climber, swimming instructor, and former gymnast. I taught him to kite and he got the basics straight away. It still took him a month of regular sessions to break it and get comfortably riding. He would generally do the same wrong things over and over, or find new ways to mess up.

Having said all that, beginners make a few fundamental mistakes all the time:

1. Trying to get on the board before they have developed their kiteflying skills. If you can't fly the kite almost automatically there's no way you are going to be able to keep it under control while stuffing around with the board.

2. When water starting head off more downwind and try to get some board speed up before heading upwind. Not dead downwind. Say 2/3-3/4 downwind.

3. Almost every kiter keeps the bar pulled too far and in and the kite half stalled, especially when the kite is downwind and at the bottom of the window.

4. Most newbies ride out 50-100m, fall off, body drag in then walk back to start again. In an afternoon they may only get 500m riding. Find a spot with a lot of space downwind and a lot of beaches downwind. Once you can ride a bit and not crash your kite too easily, and relaunch reliably you are better off staying out and riding back and forth. You will get at least a couple of km riding and could get 4-5km. You will end up way downwind but it is better to ride for an hour, pack up and walk back 2-3 km.


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:05 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:28 am
Posts: 362
Location: Cape Town
It's quite a common pb when you start.

You are trying to go upwind too quickly - When you water-start, keep the edge of your board downwind. Then throw your kite (gently) into the power zone and lock it once you have been lifted (i.e. do not throw it back in neutral at 12 once you get lifted out of the water).
Let your kite lift you out of the water by throwing it in the power zone, do not pull on the bar simultaneously as you will have too much power to handle.

Thereafter you can start edging and go upwind.

Good luck


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:20 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 1:56 pm
Posts: 67
Thanks guys.
Makes sense, try going downwind more before turning. And not pulling on the bar to much when the kite is lower in the window n stalling. Cant help but pull on the bloody thing without meanin to sometimes!!

Thanks again =)


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:48 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:36 am
Posts: 8479
Location: Oahu
philmb wrote:
Hey all =)

I'm up on my board now but having a bit of difficulty keeping going. I watch people, they swoop the kite, get up on the board n then "park" their kite n off they go....

I keep loosing power for what ever reason. I get up, fly along a bit n then just sink! Most people i spoke to that are learning have the same problem, so obviously quite a popular problem among learners..

What made it "click" for you guys? Any advice, or whatever greatly appreciated.

Thanks... =)


Are you as powered as the other guys? Also Are they marginally powered? Lightwind kiting is very technical, so make you sure you have enough power.

What made it click for me was a big ass board. I was on a too small board in the beginning, and I did not have enough power to get out of the water. I bought a big TT and went upwind on my second session.


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:38 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:03 am
Posts: 252
Location: Hangin with Toby Watchin
fixed bar... :o
Just like a trainer kite... :roll:
No problems. No pushing, No pulling... :shhh:
Just Steering the kite. :bye:


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:15 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 1:56 pm
Posts: 67
Hm, thanks for all the replys. Definatley helping..

Whats the difference in having your kite lower in the window, like when your walking down the beach.. And having it lower in the window when your riding and having your kite "parked"?? I mean when your walking down the beach there isnt that much pull on the kite (well there is a bit i suppose).. But when riding you seem to have your kite in a simuler position but its pulling you through the water fast. Am i missing something here or is it that first power stroke that makes all the difference??

Thanks again..


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:19 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2003 1:00 am
Posts: 2562
Location: Madison, Wi. Cabrinha, Slingshot, Blade, Axis, Mystic, NP Surf.
Phil,

That's an easy one. It's the difference of where the kite is in the wind window comparing to you mostly standing still or moving through the water at 20mph+. Let's say in both cases, your kite is only 20 feet above the water, but in one case you are walking and the other you are riding at 20+. When walking, your kite will be much much further forward in the wind window and at the edge of the power zone...hence very little pull.

Once you get up and riding at 20+, the kite cannot go that far to the edge of the wind window....hence much more pull.

So like the guys above are saying to help you stay up...get moving across the wind with some speed BEFORE trying to edge and go upwind.

hope this helps,

bob
www.kiteridersllc.com


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 Post subject: Re: Keeping going.....
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:26 pm 
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Posts: 2320
Not to just contradict what toylet said, but the difference in pull is mainly related to the apparent wind flowing over the kite.
Or at any rate, the relationship of apparent wind and power would be useful for you to learn.
Like toylet said, it matters where the kite is in the window, but also how it got there!

When you dive the kite the first time, the kite makes a big pull because diving it makes it accelerate from having air flow across it at true wind speed to traveling across the window at 25+ mph. (That is the central factor of kiting that makes it cool. The kite can have a lot of apparent wind while the rider is stationary, or vice versa!).
So you feel a big surge to waterstart with, the same amount of pull as if you were riding at 20mph or more.
But the surge of power still only gets you from zero to 5 or 10mph, because it only lasts the second or two it takes to dive the kite.
If you keep pulling on the kite, after it stops pulling on you, you slow down or sink.
So the next thing to do is to glide with the board almost flat while you steer the kite back up. If you keep leaning back, you fall (unless wind is strong and you know what you are doing ...patience!).
As the kite turns and starts to accelerate back up in the window, it starts making more power again, accelerating you from your slow speed to a faster speed.
But again a sec later, the power is less and the kite is near zenith, so you steer it down again, slowly leaning back a little bit.
Usually by this time you have built enough speed up that you can park the kite, although in light wind, you may have to keep waving the kite up and down.
But when you first park the kite, you often will have to flatten the board out a little bit and head downwind a few seconds to let the apparent wind and power build up, before you can start to edge a bit. Really this has a similar effect to waving the kite - it lets the kite move through the air faster, making more power - but it is like "waving" the board instead of the kite.

All this stuff is more obvious with C kites, or smaller size kites, but itcomes into play with any kite.
The key at the beginner stage is usually to learn how to lean back BARELY ENOUGH to not get pulled over your toes. You develop a feel for the combinations of speed, pressure, window position, etc, that you need to keep riding.
THEN you are ready to try edging a bit more and getting upwind.
It may take all season or if you are lucky you might get one really good session with great conditions and get it wired. Don't be afraid to go down wind a bit, if you are in a safe place!
Have fun.


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