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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:05 pm 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
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Hey Dimitri, I'd like to demo the Infinity v2. I currently own a 2010 Ozone Zephyr and could do some back to back comparison testing. I'll let the other locals ride 'em both for more feedback and post up a comparison video as well.
We are pretty much in the heart of our lightwind season here in central Texas, so we'll have plenty of opportunity to test lightwind kites here and on the coast in Texas City, Corpus Christ, or South Padre Island.
As far as lightwind boards, I own a 146x46 Cabrina plasma and have access to a FlyDoorXL (170x50) as well as other medium to big twintips and a couple of surfboards.
I don't know how the shipping scenario works, but I'd be willing to pay shipping both ways (I've shipped plenty of kites, so I know shouldn't be more than $35 to get here from NC and $35 back via UPS if you pack it down small (kite+bar, no pump)). Let me know! 8)

Hello "sleepymexi",
Sorry I have been very busy. Please email me at dimitri@epickites.com so I can take care of your request. Should have one of the demo back in few days. Then once you demo it, please post your thoughts about what you think about the kite good or bad. I just want people to know the truth what you like and what you did not like about the kite. Also the INFINITY v1 flies on 22 meter lines compare to the Zephyr that flies on 27meter lines. Longer lines will great more power to the kite. And this is the reason why the INFINITY V2 comes with 22 meter lines + 5 meter extensions extra in the bag.


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:28 pm 
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Location: Austin,TX USA
Email sent! Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 6:46 pm 
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Happy to answer you Toyletbowl. The video in ocean strapless for likeliness of "upwelling" proofs are: video shot on 9/11 after passage of hurricane Katia which means top water surface was replaced by "colder/denser" sea floor water. I see the wind meter on beach at 3.4 to 5.6 knots pointing in a "southerly" direction.Other proof "downwind launch parallel" to coastline.Kite flies over head nice and tight in what seems 8 knots(9.2mph).The sand color near water edge has more amber color than usual.Higher plankton content.When kiter rides heelside and especially toeside at 178lbs on 5'7"x 19.2(49cm) surfboard with 22m lines effortlessly "going that fast" takes in my opinion 10.5 knots(12mph).The whole video is the PROOF in itself because i have been there done that in "all types" of UPWELLING conditions(those who don't know Google)......Now to explain the video in Albemarle sound at Jockey's ridge on short 135x47 Oxygen twin tip.The reasons the kiter does so well are: Wind measured 7 to 8 knots by" kiter in water".Glassy shallow "very high salinity" water (almost like the ocean)on "that side" of sound.Perfect NW wind direction for that spot,very steady, undisturbed with almost a 15 mile long fetch.So "way before" it approaches the coastline and because the wind is light it "hovers" 10 feet above water at minimum speed 10.5 knots(12mph).Cape Hatteras ocean and sounds are my opinion "unbeatable to produce" mind boggling INF. 7to 8knots "wind meter measured" videos in glasslike waters(without any trickery).Where i ride for over 12 years it is a smaller scale "Hatteras" with Atlantic ocean and intracoastal rivers.We can ride all year long on 'any" of the 16 wind directions. So with 48 years of lightwind experience (sailboats,windsurfers,kite) i can explain what i see because i experienced it myself many,many times........ I'm just saying. Thank you. :) :)


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 4:42 am 
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Location: Madison, Wi. Cabrinha, Slingshot, Blade, Axis, Mystic, NP Surf.
You didn't answer anything except to repeat what you already said for the most part. You've done a good job of trying to establish credibility, but the info is mostly theory unless you can PROOVE me wrong. So, what proof do you have that you are right? Your info comes across as theory only though.

Question.

Have you ridden OBX a lot? Ocean and Sound? Just curious if you actually know the area or is it just theory based on experiences in different locations?

Here are some observations that potentially discredit your theory.

Dimitri says straight out that the wind meter says 3.4 -5.6 at ground level and gives a higher up allowance for it being 6-8. Credible if you believe the ground level reading. So he's already making an allowance for it being a tad breezier than the meter. He does this more than once in his vids to give us all the benefit of the doubt.

Watch closely when he dives the kite. Anyone who flies light wind kites in light winds can see that there's no way that is 12mph. A 12mph wind would create a much faster turning kite and more power for sure from that high up. I've flown the Infinity and it's a lot faster turning that that in 10-12mph. The drop is also slow. The kite is just not moving fast. Looks like a legit 6-8 to me from my vast many many years of kiteboarding and windsurfing.

Regarding windsurfing...you mention that you never felt this in your 26 years. Me either. Can you explain then why Dimitri is flying his kite close to the water most all the time and he still has power? If you didn't feel it in 26 years on a windsurfer, then Dimitri should not feel it either since the kite is low most of the time.

Your quote..."Now tell my honestly that you do not know about what the effect of "UPWELLING" (please Google it) has on creating "double" the wind strength 10 feet and above over the glassy ocean. The light wind direction is "always" southerly (sse-s-ssw) during this phenomenon and parallel to coastline.So if it measures only 6mph on beach the you will get double or 12mph on the water!!!! Now if i am teaching you something that's ok..."

The above comes across as condescending, and you're actually trying to tell us that from 0 feet to 10 feet the wind speed goes from 6mph to 12mph? I understand that you're inferring that the wind is stronger up high which may be true, but not that much and again, Dimitri is flying the kite close to the water, not up high.

Now...he is a pro level rider which helps, but he's also using a 5'7" board that is somewhat wide, but if you know Dimitri, that board will have a decent amount of rocker, so it's not like he's out in a wide flat fish to max his riding.

Everything that I know about light wind riding and watching and feeling how kites fly in those winds tell me he's close to the 6-9mph winds as mentioned.

Also...before you go off on me about being biased, I challenge Dimitri a lot and often ask for proof on things. I like proof from all parties and this one seems legit by Dimitri, so I'm standing up for him on this issue.

One last thing..no way is the sound wind texture 12mph. That video looks quite accurate also.

Hope this helps clear things up.

Bob
www.kiteridersllc.com


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 7:47 pm 
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Hello Bob from toyletbowl.I will play nice. You have UPWELLING in lake Michigan(as per Google) .With all your experience don't you remember a few sessions that were "surreal"? Water like glass,barely a whisper of wind on land.Yet as soon as kite goes up and you get on the water (even if the kite is only 10 feet from water when riding) you are flying fast and easy.That phenomenon is "not" very common. You almost have to be there to believe it.No one in their right mind would even consider rigging up on a day like that.Magic stronger wind that "hovers"quietly above the water(and not the land) .Come on you have had those days! Very hard to prove without "videos" indeed. Yes i have been to Hatteras many times and know the place is ideal (if not the best in the world) to make tube kiting light wind videos with virtually glassy water. Talented Dimitri is very fortunate to reside and film in his backyard.Not all "surreal" sessions are due to upwelling however but the effects are quite the same for kiting as explained above.So Bob have you ever seen UFO'S and tried to prove it? I never did myself but i bet it would be difficult or even impossible to do.So did you ever have a session that was beyond logical explanation? Please send me your best story and i will believe you. Thanks :) :)


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:10 am 
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SupaEZ, how do you explain the many other videos and kiters that vouch for the lightwind. You are claiming that upwelling is the cause of this kites strong performance in the video and upwelling is a very rare occurrence. Just doesn't add up when you throw in videos like the one I posted where upwelling clearly isn't happening.


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 3:55 am 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
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Poster: "grantman54"
SupaEZ, how do you explain the many other videos and kiters that vouch for the lightwind. You are claiming that upwelling is the cause of this kites strong performance in the video and upwelling is a very rare occurrence. Just doesn't add up when you throw in videos like the one I posted where upwelling clearly isn't happening.

Hello "grantman54",
If you do a search on all Mr. SupaEZ topics, you will see that he promotes and rides for North Kites and probably this is the reason why he doesn't beleive in the light wind performance of the INFINITY. Wait until you see some new videos of the INFINITY v2 plus a testimonial from the "US Sales manager of the KITEWORLD magazine" who just tested the INFINITY v2 yesterday here on the OUTER BANKS, NC. He was blown away by its performance in 7 to 9 knots.

P.S. New Video coming very soon.

:thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 5:04 am 
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Dimitri M wrote:
he promotes and rides for North Kites and probably this is the reason why he doesn't beleive in the light wind performance of the INFINITY

:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:11 am 
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That wind meter is a joke for any accuracy in low winds.

I have a wide 360 wind meter that measures wind much like a weather station.
When compared to those junky little one's in low wind the difference if really quite large.

I'll me getting 9/10 while the little meters are getting 6/7 and sometimes less.

But Dimitri is not claiming great accuracy in the wind reading and states there is more than the meter is reading.

Conditions certainly looked light and believe me I've ridden light winds.

One thing about open areas like that is that you get smooth wind... makes a big ass difference
with low wind.

Don't expect the same performance in different areas, or expect to get that performance form day 1.

The kite looks very fluid and steady in the air and quite responsive as well as not signs of backstall.

Looks like a good performer to me. Water looked pretty glassy to.

Also a thing to note is that Dimitri was quite far back on the board rather than riding the board very flat. This indicated that the kite despite moving slow (due to low wind) it was generating quite some grunt. It would be interesting to see how it performs with a fast mini gun surfboard like the Don Johnson 6'8". Rides like a surfboard and goes upwind at the very low end of your kite kind of approaching the performance of a race board.

For many riders an important thing is how well the water relaunch is at the low end and in deep water.

I'll definitley give the kite a spin if it shows up here in the Malibu area.


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 Post subject: Re: Renegade "Infinity V2" light wind machine.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 1:52 pm 
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Hello "FredBGG",
I just sen the INFINITY v1 to Mr. "sleepymexi". I could not send him the V2 because this is the only one I have now and I am having a lot of demos here in Hatteras. But email me with your info so I can put you on the list. This is my email: dimitri@epickites.com


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