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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:05 pm 
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Cray wrote:
A nice long thread :-) with everyone pimping his own brand. Kiteforum @ its best :-)))).
...
The ugly naked truth is: Nylon cloth and PU bladders are super sensitive.
...

Maybe we should demand more to know what cloth, lines, dacron and bladders are used in a kite. Paragliders always pimp their materials.


Agreed !!
Hang gliders also pimp there materials, along with PG's ; and it's a Major selling point.

As for the pimping the brand I use part :
MY 2008 Ozone Edge is as Good & New looking as the day it was purchased ! :D
Never had to replace a bladder, & the sail survived 3 years of torture, in the
Mohave Sun !!

Bille


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:38 pm 
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Cray wrote:
A nice long thread :-) with everyone pimping his own brand. Kiteforum @ its best :-)))). The ugly naked truth is: Nylon cloth and PU bladders are super sensitive. They do make up together great things that pull us through water and give us lot's of joy but in the end: Kites are f***ing sensitive.

Hopefully Tejin, Porcher, Gelvenor ... keep improving their gentle cloths and bring more durability. Until then we are stuck with our loved and super sensitive equipment.

Maybe we should demand more to know what cloth, lines, dacron and bladders are used in a kite. Paragliders always pimp their materials.

I would love to know what cabrina use for their canopy material as no one ever comes out and says what it is in public, why the silence?


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:54 am 
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fdvj wrote:
Cray wrote:
[...]
Maybe we should demand more to know what cloth, lines, dacron and bladders are used in a kite. Paragliders always pimp their materials.

I would love to know what cabrina use for their canopy material as no one ever comes out and says what it is in public, why the silence?


My guess? Every top brand uses Teijin T9600:
http://www.teijinfiber.com/english/prod ... force.html

I've inspected the canopy materials on some top brand kites and AFAIK it all feels and looks all the same: Core, Ozone, F-One, Slingshot.... and I've seen each and every one of those cloths go down in shreds ;-))). And that wasn't limited to "old" and "abused" kites.

North uses D2, which seems to me the same as T9600, only the reinforcing fibre is doubled.


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:29 am 
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Cabrinha uses a fake Teijin, there was a post a little while back that named what material each brand uses. Also last year the varnish they put on the kites cracked away after a few uses. They looked old after very little use.


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:32 am 
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Cray wrote:
My guess? Every top brand uses Teijin T9600:
http://www.teijinfiber.com/english/prod ... force.html

I've inspected the canopy materials on some top brand kites and AFAIK it all feels and looks all the same: Core, Ozone, F-One, Slingshot.... and I've seen each and every one of those cloths go down in shreds ;-))). And that wasn't limited to "old" and "abused" kites.

North uses D2, which seems to me the same as T9600, only the reinforcing fibre is doubled.


Nah, Cabrinha (which I count as a top brand too) uses different crap material.
Would you like to see photos of my 6 months old kite?


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:36 am 
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Jbrook wrote:
Cabrinha uses a fake Teijin, there was a post a little while back that named what material each brand uses. Also last year the varnish they put on the kites cracked away after a few uses. They looked old after very little use.


Hah, Jason you beat me! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:13 pm 
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Cray wrote:
fdvj wrote:
Cray wrote:
[...]
Maybe we should demand more to know what cloth, lines, dacron and bladders are used in a kite. Paragliders always pimp their materials.

I would love to know what cabrina use for their canopy material as no one ever comes out and says what it is in public, why the silence?


My guess? Every top brand uses Teijin T9600:
http://www.teijinfiber.com/english/prod ... force.html

I've inspected the canopy materials on some top brand kites and AFAIK it all feels and looks all the same: Core, Ozone, F-One, Slingshot.... and I've seen each and every one of those cloths go down in shreds ;-))). And that wasn't limited to "old" and "abused" kites.

North uses D2, which seems to me the same as T9600, only the reinforcing fibre is doubled.


"Kite-boarding is a new exciting marine sport for the new century. This sport is very easy to start, so getting popular sport,especially in Western seaside. Now the population of Kite-boarding is growing rapidly.

Kite-boarding is also getting popular sport in Japan in recent years. You can see many people playing kite-boarding seaside in Japan like this picture. Of course, almost of kites are using "TECHNO FORCE™/T9600"."


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:54 pm 
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Quote:
NORTH /NAISH /F-ONE /SLING SHOT /BEST /OZONE /...,famed major brands are adopting
"TECHNO FORCE™/T9600", and it has a 90% market share in our estimate.

hmmmm


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:30 am 
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Jbrook wrote:
Cabrinha uses a fake Teijin, there was a post a little while back that named what material each brand uses. Also last year the varnish they put on the kites cracked away after a few uses. They looked old after very little use.


See Caesar, I told you Cabrinha use crap material, and you have first hand experience of how their kites fall to pieces. Do yourself a favour and never buy there s**t again. They are truly horrible kites... fake material, over engineered bar, heavy bar pressure and horrible feed back due to the obscene amount of pulleys they use.


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 Post subject: Re: What are the most durable/reliable kites these days?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 7:44 am 
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Caesar,

Just to clarify things i am a distributor of Liquid Force and also repair kites / boards professionally for the last 2 years.

I was kiting for years and had flown many kites before getting into this business. Before even starting off with Liquid Force i had a few other famous brands to choose from, LF was a brand of choice due to their quality.

I get many kites for repair and i have not gotten a Liquid Force kite....i had a customer owner of an Liquid Force Assault 2007 who had a tear after a lot of unsuccessful attempts for a tangle pass = hitting the water!

Famous brands use low quality material...Cabrinha used the most durable materials in the past but now they use lower quality.

There are companies like Naish who use good material but the construction is super heavy = no low end! Leading to tears as some parts of the kite are so so so hard making other parts fragile!

Other brands unfortunately have bad designs...in the last month i got 4 kites of a company, same model breaking at the same place...inside they add a material to strengthen that specific part. I checked these kites and they have an added material that is sharp / a bit too hard (no round corners) which leads to a hole while is pumped up = explosion of the leading edge!

"It's like the surf industry...most companies do not use epoxy glue / extruded cells blanks which are higher quality / performance due to the added costs...they sell polyester boards for bigger margins"

Liquid Force have top quality, design, performance on their kites, boards etc...!

All the best,

Philios.


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