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 Post subject: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 10:58 am 
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Location: France Saint Malo, China Shanghai
Hello Guys,

Can you pls help to explain the difference between those Oneill wetsuits :

PYROTECH
Psycho 3
Psychofreak

I am looking for a 4.5/3 or 4/3 but can't really figure out which is the best bet for kitesurfing in the Oneill Range.

thx a lot


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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 11:22 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:05 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2001 1:00 am
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Location: France Saint Malo, China Shanghai
Thx a lot but I'd love kitesurfer advice as most of review I can find come from surfing shop and not kitesurfers

Thx a lot


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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 1:33 pm 
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flysurfing wrote:
Thx a lot but I'd love kitesurfer advice as most of review I can find come from surfing shop and not kitesurfers

Thx a lot


Wetsuits tend to be chosen based on personal preferences.

I have owned a lot of O'Neill suits.

The 2015 5/4 Epic is a good value suit. I found the soft collar has frayed a little, but the rest of the suit is lasting OK.

I bought a 6/5/4 Heat with integral hood. Haven't used it much, but I do find the chest zip more difficult to use and especially when your muscles get cold, it feels like you could pull a muscle getting it off.

I have a Psycho 1 5/3 which has been a good suit and has lasted well. I like the Zen pull over the head collar and rear zip. Effective, easy to get on and off and comfortable. It also makes it easy to wear a hood as well. So I have just bought a 2015 5/4 Gooru which is a better value IMO version of the Psycho 3. Haven't worn it yet.

A lot of it is personal preference IMO.


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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 2:48 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 7:28 am
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Location: Hamburg
They all are very good suits for kitesurfing.
It depends how much you want to spend for a little extra bit of flexibility and warmth. I read on our local forum that the O`Neills tend to be more flexible than other models in general. So they are all nice flexible suits.

I had a Psychofreak back zip model (4,5/3,5) for four years and was very happy with it. The O'Neill sizing fits like a glove for me so I tend to stick with them (also have a Psycho 1 3/2 and a shorty).
I bought the Psychofreak as I wanted to have their warmest suit in the 5mm range.
I now have got the 2015 Psychofreak (5/4) chest zip. I have tried it on but not used it yet as it is drysuit weather right now. You can feel the development over the last years, it is a bit more stretchy (and my old model was very good already) and a lot lighter.
I also like that they increased the thickness a bit. Especially on the arms and shoulders as I feel cold and wind chill there at first.
I use the Psychofreak between roughly 10 and 18-20 degrees celsius air temp.

The Psychofreak and the Psycho 3 have a stitchless seam with a smaller fluid weld on both sides.
The Pyrotech has a wider fluid weld only on the outside.

I do not know if they still produce the Psychofreak with a back zip, so if you prefer this the Psycho 3 might be the option.
For chest zip either Pyrotech or Psychofreak.


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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 3:35 pm 
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Beside the double side fluid welding the difference in price between the models is the amount of their highstretch neopren (Technobutter :roll: ) in its normal version and " air" version (small air cambers in the neopren) used, with the Psychofreak having the largest amount of the air version.


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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 4:53 pm 
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For those of us who have been surfing for a long time, the modern wetsuits are so much warmer and comfortable, that all these wetsuits seem great. Most companies are making good quality suits. The technology has come a long way. Couple of things to keep in mind.
1) You get what you pay for. Most companies have budget models and top-end
2) What is important in a surf wetsuit may not be as important in a kite suit and vice versa.

If you ever paddled out in a head high cold day, two things happen. One, your arms and shoulders feel on fire and you would gladly sacrifice some warmth for lightness and flexibility. Two, as you paddle through a wave depending on the neck and zipper design water flushes you.
So the movement has been to make suits more flexible, and that comes at a cost to you. In the past years this has been done with more flexible and better neoprenes, and I will tell you compared to the old days they are far more flexible. So it looks like O'neil is using what they call Technobutter 2, and that is more expensive than the ones without it in their lineup.
http://www.surfersvillage.com/content/w ... nobutter-2
The other thing that makes suits stiff is in the traditional stitching. Historically seams were stitched, and there is little give in the stitched areas. So the movement has been to reduces the number of panels that require stitching, and "weld" the seams instead of traditional stitches. These welds provide more stretch. The weld and type of weld is a cost difference among those suits in the lineup.
To avoid flushing a lot of companies have done different things including adding barriers and different zipper designs. For surfers the front zip is popular because as you dive through a wave the back zips can flush far easier. However, this is not a big problem for kiters and these suits can be much harder to put on. That is another difference between those suits.
Surf suits need to be more durable than kite suits. You are laying or sitting on a board. To be more durable they are lined with nylon over the neoprene. Although this provides durability it holds water. As wind blows across the suit the water evaporates taking energy, and making you colder. This is why wind sport wetsuits are often smooth skin, to dry faster. You will see some differences in the amount of smooth skin.
Another difference to consider is that in kiting you are standing most of the time and water pools around the legs ("elephant legs"). Wind sport suits usually have a way to drain, surf suits will not.

So the differences in these suits is the type of neoprene, type of seams, zipper design, internal lining. It looks to me that some of them are, model improvements of previous years. The Psychofreak looks like a superfreak with the new Technobutter and welded seams instead of glued and blindstiched.

So if it is a pure kiting wetsuit, you may not have to get the top end most flexible suit to be satisfied. It is not as important as kiting. You may want to look at the faster drying suit (more smoothskin) which is more important for windsports than surfing. You may want a traditional back zip because the ease of getting in out overshadows any flushing problems (unless you are still body dragging a lot). Also these are all surf specific suits, so you may or may not experience "elephant legs". Some people add a whole at the ankles if this is a problem.

One of the biggest things is fit. That is one of the big reasons there is a lot of personal preferences because some companies fit a certain body type better. Like running shoes. That has been another big advancement in suits with precision cuts and premolding of panels. There are some brands that fit me like a glove, where others I seem to be between sizes or are baggie in areas or too tight in areas. To tight is uncomfortable, and baggie is cold. So before picking a brand, see if they fit well.

So try to avoid the adjectives, but here are their descriptions. Bottom line you can sort by cost. The most expensive will have the better neoprene, stitching, zippers, and linings. You just got to determine, how much you need.

PSYCHOFREAK 4.5/3.5MM
NEW TECHNOBUTTER 2: O’Neill’s exclusive and improved evolution of our original TechnoButter, the world’s most advanced neoprene. TECHNOBUTTER 2 offers the same lightweight quick-drying performance, but now it’s more durable with improved velcro resistance.

Features:
1 Double Super Seal Neck
2 Double SuperSeam Weld (Watertight Stitchless Technology)
3 Technobutter-Air & Technobutter Neoprene
4 Super Minimal Seam Design
5 Super Seal Cuffs
6 Krypto Knee Padz
7 External Key Pocket with Loop
8 Plasma Wrist and Ankle Seals
9 Patented Z.E.N. Zip Closure System with Drainhole
10 Contortionist Seamless Shoulder
11 Strategic Seamless Paddle Zones
12 LSD: Lumbar Seamless Design


SUPERFREAK 4/3MM
The insane SuperFreak. Now warmer than ever, the SuperFreak is built with FluidFlex™ Firewall in the Front Chest and Back. The SuperFreak keeps the water out and keeps you warm like no other wetsuit ever offered at this price level. The Superfreak is also available in hooded and Women’s models. More freaks of nature from your friends at O’Neill.

The O'Neill SuperFreak features:
· 100% UltraFlex DS
· F.U.Z.E Closure System
· Minimal Seam Design
· Glued and Blindstitch Seam Construction (GBS)
· Critically taped seam junctions
· Double Super Seal Neck
· Krypto Kneepad
· New Super Glide Zipper
· New Integrated External Key Pocket (on thigh)
· Strategic Seamless paddle zones


PYROTECH 4/3MM
O’Neill’s Pyrotech Series combines our exclusive TechnoButter neoprene with Technobutter-Air Firewall insulation, Single Fluid Seam Weld and a F.U.Z.E Closure Sytem. Lighter, warmer, more insulating and quick drying with improved ease of entry. Pyrotech is the latest advancement in cold water wetsuit technology from the leaders in innovation for over 60 years.

The O'Neill PyroTech FEATURES:
1 Double Super Seal Neck
2 F.U.Z.E. Front Upper Zip Entry with Code Red Zip and Drainholes
3 Single Fluid Seam Weld (Watertight Technology)
4 Technobutter & Technobutter-Air Firewall Neoprene
5 Super Seal Cuffs
6 Krypto Knee Padz
7 External Key Pocket with Loop
8 Plasma Wrist and Ankle Seals
9 LSD - Lumbar Seamless Design


PSYCHO 3 4/3MM
The Psycho 3 features the new exclusive TechnoButter 2 which is the most durable, lightweight, quick drying neoprene on the market and now with added velcro resistance. Technobutter 2-Air Firewall in the Chest and back and Double Super Seam Weld will keep you warm and loose. The Psycho 3 evolution from Area 52 continues to be an industry leader and keeps you performing at the top of your game.

The O'Neill Psycho 3 Features:
1 Double Super Seal Neck
2 Double SuperSeam Weld (Watertight Stitchless Technology)
3 Technobutter 2 Neoprene
4 Technobutter 2-Air Firewall Neoprene
5 Super Seal Cuffs
6 Krypto Knee Padz
7 External Key Pocket with Loop
8 Plasma Wrist and Ankle Seals
9 Patented Z.E.N. Zip Closure System with Drainhole
10 Contortionist Seamless Shoulder
11 Strategic Seamless Paddle Zones


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 Post subject: Re: Help with Oneill Wetsuit, difference between models
PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:08 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 7:28 am
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Location: Hamburg
A couple of aspects to add:
For me a good neck seal is as much important in kitesurfing and windsurfing as in pure surfing. Not nice to a have cold water rushing down your back in those crashes.

The back zip neck seal in the O'Neills is pretty good but I am expecting more from the chest zip.

I love the flexibility the good surfing suits give us for kitesurfing. Jumping, getting tweaked it all helps.


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