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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 7:50 pm 
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There might be some stores still having one of these http://vimeo.com/14030009
I beleve they were pruned from the Shinn portfolio for this year.


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:02 pm 
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The reason to "Why" they are not there, could be:

Mutants with three straps are almost useless in waves (because of the three strap itself), and the flat rocker and straight tail/edges make them even more useless in waves...

Okay, so they are definitely not waveboards, okay.

Then we could use them for freestyle ?
Hmmm, no, they dont actually land well backwards from super powered megaloops :(
Besides, no advantage in freestyle, to have to jibe :(

So they are not good for freestyle either (not bad, but compared to a TT they are...)

What about light wind then, because of the flat rocker ?

They are not bad for lightwind, but compared to even the smallest freeraceboard, they suck, because they are waaaaay too narrow.

Even a skimboard with or without straps are better in light wind.

So instead of having a board that is equally well at all three (waves/freestyle/light wind), you have a board that is equally BAD at all three :x

I am pretty sure this is why they dont really exist no more...

There is ONE thing they do better than everything else though - JUMPING HIGH !

They can go fast as hell, lots of control in chop, and good grip with the rear fins - so awesome jumping machines :thumb:

BUT, in 2004-5-6 we loved boosting as high as possible, yes.

Today, it gets really boring just boosting, and we want more and different things - namely riding waves, OR technical freestyle, OR light wind.

And all three disciplines, also for the freerider, are three very different boards :rollgrin:

We are so "spoiled" by having so many good boards and riding so many years, that we dont want boards that are to much of a compromise, and dont really do anything really well.
Riding back and fourth and jumping high is only fun the first years - then it gets boring and we want to explore all dimensions of kitesurfing, and not just this very "basic" state of ones progression 8)

At least this is why I think these "older" mutant boards are extinct today :naughty:

Then 5-6 years ago, the wide two strapped mutants were "almost" popular a year or two - they worked better because they were wider, and could be used in waves for rookies who could not jibe.
Again - they all turned out to be too much of a (bad) compromise for the public, so only a very small niche nowadays (and around here noone is riding these today actually) :wink:
But a three strap wide light wind mutant ? Why ?
You got the wide Shinn and the Norht Skimfish etc which are better IMO, and two strap.


My point is, those old classic mutants sucked in waves, and not good for freestyle nor light wind either - so "worked so well in these conditions" you say ?
Nope - only according to the "time back then".
Go ride one today, and compare (we have done that, just for fun - and discovered WHY they died).

:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:04 pm 
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Kiteus Polaris wrote:
There might be some stores still having one of these http://vimeo.com/14030009
I beleve they were pruned from the Shinn portfolio for this year.


Something like that flat at the back only with 3 straps.


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:10 pm 
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Peter_Frank wrote:
Go ride one today, and compare (we have done that, just for fun - and discovered WHY they died).

:D Peter


I didn't like the old mutants that could be ridden both ways. Too long. Why rocker at the back? It was for people who didn't want to learn jibing.


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:26 pm 
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I am looking at that Shinn Capri thinking what a wasted opportunity. Why twin tip straps why forcing me riding toe side longer than I want to. This board needs 3 straps.


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:31 pm 
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marlboroughman wrote:
Peter_Frank wrote:
Go ride one today, and compare (we have done that, just for fun - and discovered WHY they died).

:D Peter


I didn't like the old mutants that could be ridden both ways. Too long. Why rocker at the back? It was for people who didn't want to learn jibing.


The old mutants had zero rocker !

Only the newer ones (2007-8 and forward) had more rocker (and were wider) for waves that is.

The old mutants (narrow fast with 2/3/4 fins plus nose fins and no rocker) are from around 2001-2002 where they were popular.
Too long you say ? The most classic used by heavy guys too, was the Naish 4'10 mutant 8)

How short do you want it to be if 4'10 is long ?

:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:34 pm 
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marlboroughman wrote:
I would like to ride a mutant like this. Why not making them smaller?
I would like lite wind mutant like this:
Why they don't make them any more. More lite wind performance from smaller size. 140 cm perfect for travel in a smallest of travel bags. Why?

marlboroughman wrote:
No man twin tip rocker twin tip straps not for me. :)

Huh? From everything you stated above, how are the Mutant M1 or M2 boards from Amundson not for you? They're definitely not "twin tip rocker twin tips straps" as you put it. Plus these boards can be custom made to order, so I'm sure John could add a tri-strap option if you wanted it. ;-)


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:36 pm 
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marlboroughman wrote:
Excectly and we need three straps on great lakes caribbean hatteras etc. We don't stand on the top of the board like you guys. We chase the wave with speed like windsurfers.


I have the 5'4'' but they also make a 5'0'' version. I am going to try it with different more surfy fins..the stock fins are awesome for lightwind and tracking upwind, but not great surf fins (I'm thinking).


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:42 pm 
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Maybe an Amundson Freestyle Wave with a tri-strap insert would suit you better. You can order it as small as 55"(140cm).
http://www.amundsoncustoms.com/johns-bo ... urfboards/

Btw... I'm not affiliated with Amundson, I just like what he's offing in boards and their ride quality.


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 Post subject: Re: Why? Why? Why?
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:49 pm 
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Da Yoda wrote:
marlboroughman wrote:
Huh? From everything you stated above, how are the Mutant M1 or M2 boards from Amundson not for you?

The straps on these boards are one way twin tip so no jibing. Once I see fins in the front I know the rocker is not what it could be if it was designed going one way. Also the stance for twin tip straps is wider. So you see everything is half ass of what it could be.


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