That sounds strange... Have you looked at the mechanism? Very very easy and hard to get it wrong even with it full of sand... same idea as the North bar - you puch away a cuff. Just were did it jam?It releases very well when clean, but doesn't work when there is sand in it.
Throw it away (better yet, send it back to the manufacturer with a complaint and demand a working version, doesn't matter if it is new or used, manufacturers should be held responsible for releasing death traps onto the market).
Sorry you just don´t get it... the chickenloop works fine. Don´t go around talking bullshit if you dont know the gear. The double depowerline gives less depower than the redline, that´s were the big issue is. On this model they had QR-handles on steering lines and lets you fly out the kite on one line, the year after on the front lines as well. The second one was the best bar ever to selfland even in sick stormy conditions in the mountains on hard ice.You don't need to replace the whole bar, a good kiteshop will sell chicken loop replacements. They aren't super expensive, maybe $50-$75
Yes, I've looked at the mechanism. That jam appear to be due to tightness between the inner plastic piece and the outer plastic cuff. Even after I've cleaned it, I've noticed some variability in difficulty of releasing, as little as about 10 pounds of force, as much as about 20. With some sand in it, that goes way up (maybe 50 or 60 pounds, but that is just a guess).john a wrote:
"It releases very well when clean, but doesn't work when there is sand in it."
That sounds strange... Have you looked at the mechanism? Very very easy and hard to get it wrong even with it full of sand... same idea as the North bar - you puch away a cuff. Just were did it jam?
I learned on a 2 line c-kite and a 3-line foil in 2001. I have flown a great number of different kites since then. I remember kiting without a QR, I also remember never using a donkey dick, avoiding gusty conditions like the plague, and being scared of on-shore winds. Another thing I remember is hearing about serious injuries and fatalities far more frequently than we do now. I have some fairly large scars from not being able to release a kite, so do many people who were kiting early on. It was a different sport then. Simply put, QR's have instilled a sense of complacency in kiters, which is fine, as long as they work every time, but a non-reliable QR is far, far, far worse than no QR.john a wrote: This was a great and safe bar at it´s time, guess you haven´t bin around since the early days remember way worse systems
I'm surprised you don't agree with me about the importance of reliable safety systems if you have had some "crashed bones". Kite companies have, by and large, really stepped up their game from the early days. I think this is awesome, but at the same time, it makes poorly working releases in modern kites all the more unacceptable. If company can't design and test their own working QR, they can license it from one of the great number of other companies that have excellent QRs. A couple of injuries and a number of really scary situations have made me really appreciate working safety systems and depowerable kites. I'm glad you survived all of your kiting accidents. Unfortunately, some people don't survive. Looking at the most recent posting on this forum of a fatality viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2380364&start=10 , there is some indication that the QR failed to release (An F-one bar. There were other contributing factors as well, but this can't be ignored). Publicly stating when a release doesn't work is not bashing a company, it is being a responsible member of the kiting community.john a wrote: and I´ve survived even with some crashed bones hehe, but seriously that is just a lame statement.
Nope, only when the accident is due to faulty equipment. A quick release that doesn't work because it was exposed to sand is absolutely not acceptable, it indicates a company releasing something to the market that either A.) they have not tested or B.) they have tested and know it doesn't work as advertised. I can't sue Toyota because my engine died sooner than I expected, but I absolutely can sue them if properly maintained brakes stick and it leads to an accident.The vast majority of kiting injuries are due to stupid kiters, but sometimes it is due to faulty equipment, and yes, I think the manufacturers are absolutely responsible for those small subset of kiting injuries.john a wrote:So if anybody dies from kiting, then it´s the manufacturers fault? Yeah right
I do get it. I have used two Best bars, and both had garbage QRs. This stopped being acceptable in about 2007. Reliable QRs became widely available sometime around 2005 or 2006. I'm not down on Best, I have two of their kites, one of which is awesome, the other is pretty good, but the original poster asked about the reliability of his QR, and I told him what I could. My advice was to test it because I had a different Best bar that didn't work. This is good advice. It appears that Best has moved to a different style of QR, presumably because they know that the old one was garbage. As I stated before, I haven't used every QR on the market, no where near it, but of the modern QRs I've used (past 3 or 4 years), only the Best bars that I have used (2010?) are really terrible. The OP's bar is one generation older than mine. Maybe it works flawlessly, but mine sure doesn't.john a wrote: Sorry you just don´t get it... the chickenloop works fine. Don´t go around talking bullshit if you dont know the gear.
Yes, I agree that a QR that only releases most of the way is not ideal, and I think bars should have the option of a single line release, but it it is no where near as dangerous as a QR that doesn't release. In effect, kiting with a bar that releases to two front lines is riding suicide, which comes with some draw backs, but a kite that releases most of its power is usually ok, and when it isn't there is the secondary quick release (as long as the first one works). I usually ride suicide, I've never had any real problems with it. There is a huge difference between riding suicide (and having the ability to release your kite entirely if something goes wrong) and riding without the ability to release the kite from your harness.john a wrote: The double depowerline gives less depower than the redline, that´s were the big issue is.
There are some really nice features about my Best bar, but they don't overcome the fact that the QR doesn't work. I fly my Best kites on my flexifoil bar for this reason. You are talking about something entirely unrelated. The handles on the side of the bar, while great, are not primary quick releases. If you are being dragged by a kite and can not release from your harness, those will do absolutely nothing but put your kite into a death spin. Oh-shit handles should only be used when you are no longer hooked in. Some people use both at once for landing, and while I have't ever tried it, my understanding is that this should only be done in light wind.john a wrote: On this model they had QR-handles on steering lines and lets you fly out the kite on one line, the year after on the front lines as well. The second one was the best bar ever to selfland even in sick stormy conditions in the mountains on hard ice.
Sure newer bars are easier to put back together in the water, but the release works.
So you can still release? Try measure it then please Seemed like you couldn´t and that this thing would kill you if you looked at it heheEven after I've cleaned it, I've noticed some variability in difficulty of releasing, as little as about 10 pounds of force, as much as about 20. With some sand in it, that goes way up (maybe 50 or 60 pounds, but that is just a guess).
Matter of taste, matter of taste.. And I happen to find Jordi a great designer! More than enought grip for me at least. How much do you need? Stuff to make grip don´t feel as nice in my hand with the depowerline between the fingers. i don´t like the North system with that "pin" part that lockes the loop. The cornered cuff also annoys me, so a matter of taste...The QR handle doesn't have a great grip on it, it is simply a bad design that wasn't properly tested before being released.
Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], nothing2seehere and 17 guests