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Surf weight

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Surf weight

Postby Peter_Frank » Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:22 am

turfAndsurf wrote:I have a 5 kg 6' Caution Trespass for the surf, great on the surf and smooth on the chops. If it is 14 mph wind and up that is what I use, if it less then 14 mph then I use my 6' Firewire Potatonator surfboard (3.5 kg), which I also use for surfing when there is no wind. I have tried it in winds more than 14 mph and it starts to bounce to much not as smooth as the Trespass.


So you actually kitesurf in waves, in wind less than 14mph ? (which is 6 m/s and less or below 12 knots)

Amazing - I've never seen anyone do that (not even being out), especially not in warmer conditions :naughty:

What kitesize do you use, and what do you weigh ?

Or is it another unit you had in mind maybe ?

I would say, that it takes A LOT more wind for me, before any "light" waveboard would get bouncy in chop (78kg)

:D Peter

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tautologies
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Re: Surf weight

Postby tautologies » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:42 am

Peter_Frank wrote:So you actually kitesurf in waves, in wind less than 14mph ? (which is 6 m/s and less or below 12 knots)

Amazing - I've never seen anyone do that (not even being out), especially not in warmer conditions :naughty:

What kitesize do you use, and what do you weigh ?

Or is it another unit you had in mind maybe ?

I would say, that it takes A LOT more wind for me, before any "light" waveboard would get bouncy in chop (78kg)

:D Peter


we have some days with less than that and I've used the fly kite...I guess it is 15 meter or maybe a bit bigger side off shore..it is different than regular kiting. Works in small waves, and with light kites.

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PAFF
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Re: Surf weight

Postby PAFF » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:42 am

Johnny Rotten wrote:5'10 custom built by me.

6 lb 9 oz with stomp pad and fins.
easily could have made it lighter but
It's bombproof scratch proof and dent proof anywhere that matters. (top and rails)
For the most part I throw it around and don't even use a board bag.

It's nice when you aren't driven by profit just performance.


I would buy one that wont break, or have warranty on breaking..

Broken 9 boards in 12 month :P

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Re: Surf weight

Postby Johnny Rotten » Sun Jun 30, 2013 2:13 pm

PAFF wrote:


Broken 9 boards in 12 month :P



Cool!.
You sir are a BOARD BEATER!
How do you ride (strapped/strapless monster waves)
You doin lot's of strapped airs? land flat much?
Got any pics of your boards that were bifricated?
deckpads?
What boards broke?
Love to see how and where they are failing....description if you don't have pics.

I suspect any custom builder could make you something a bit more bomber,However making it light enough that it's not a turd may take some talent. Knowing your history though I would not put you on a 6lb board....but If you're breaking em all the same, and I can see why I could certainly take out the weak link without a lot of weight. Designing for impact and bending require different strategies to make the best use of the weight. Yet many builders don't understand the relationship and differences between bending strength, impact strength and stiffness as well as how to get the best improvement from each for the least weight.

I'm sure it will open up some good discussion from the other knowledgeable builders on the forum as well.

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joe weiss
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Re: Surf weight

Postby joe weiss » Sun Jun 30, 2013 2:48 pm

9 boards in 12 month ? Megalooping with surfs :o

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Re: Surf weight

Postby xfact » Sun Jun 30, 2013 6:09 pm

Naish Global 6', 2013 is 4.5 kg with deck pads, straps and all 4 fins.

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Re: Surf weight

Postby Outside » Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:44 pm

You didn't ask me but -

Johnny Rotten wrote:
PAFF wrote:


Broken 9 boards in 12 month :P




How do you ride (strapped/strapless monster waves) - strapless, small windswell
You doin lot's of strapped airs? - yes land flat much? - more than I would like
Got any pics of your boards that were bifricated? - limited pics
deckpads? - heel traction pads only
What boards broke?
Love to see how and where they are failing....description if you don't have pics.



Slingshot Celeritas Strapless 5'8" 5lbs 12.6oz w/ 3 SS fins (epoxy?)-
Board snapped in front of front foot from rail to rail after 90 mins of light use. SS said tough luck and offered me nothing.
Only the top deck broke, including the bamboo, the bottom of the board is intact.

Dumpster Diver 5'7" 6lbs 8.8oz w/ 3 F4 fins (fiberglass) -
Buckled and delaminated under front foot. I bought this board used. It was a mistake all around. The CI construction has no chance of standing up to kiting.

SharpEye Blowfish 5'5" 6lbs 2.4oz no fins (fiberglass) -
Buckled and delaminated under front foot. This board was well used when purchased and served me well before failing.

Rusty Pirhana 5'8" 6lbs 11oz w/ 3 F4 fins (Surftech)-
Deck of the board broke through under heal of front foot. Repaired with carbon, snapped it on one rail in same location today. I bought this board used and ride it hard.

Rick Burhans Westwind 5'11" 6lbs 11.8oz w/ 3 M3 fins (fiberglass)-
Snapped under or slightly in front of front foot. I bought this board used and rode it hard.

American Surf Solutions 5'8" 6lbs 1.8oz w/ 2 M5 fins (fiberglass)-
Deck crushed both sides of stringer under front foot for a 6-9" length. Glass never cracked through though.

I also snapped the nose of a Minami 5' 10" when I pearled in 6" of water, and completely destroyed the Bobby Z 6'4" I learned on through neglect and inexperience.

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joe weiss
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Re: Surf weight

Postby joe weiss » Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:50 pm

It's a bit disappointing that with all the new materials Eng. they didn't come up yet with a wave board that weighs 6 Lb and doesn't break.

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Re: Surf weight

Postby H53Driver » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:05 pm

I want to try Lib Tech but am waiting for them to go on sale. New materials/construction techniques make these boards pretty tough (according to the hype). And earth friendly as you will not be throwing your broke boards into the local landfill.


http://vimeo.com/43137448

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Re: Surf weight

Postby Johnny Rotten » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:53 pm

Outside wrote:You didn't ask me but -


Slingshot Celeritas Strapless 5'8" 5lbs 12.6oz w/ 3 SS fins (epoxy?)-
Board snapped in front of front foot from rail to rail after 90 mins of light use. SS said tough luck and offered me nothing.
Only the top deck broke, including the bamboo, the bottom of the board is intact.

Dumpster Diver 5'7" 6lbs 8.8oz w/ 3 F4 fins (fiberglass) -
Buckled and delaminated under front foot. I bought this board used. It was a mistake all around. The CI construction has no chance of standing up to kiting.

SharpEye Blowfish 5'5" 6lbs 2.4oz no fins (fiberglass) -
Buckled and delaminated under front foot. This board was well used when purchased and served me well before failing.

Rusty Pirhana 5'8" 6lbs 11oz w/ 3 F4 fins (Surftech)-
Deck of the board broke through under heal of front foot. Repaired with carbon, snapped it on one rail in same location today. I bought this board used and ride it hard.

Rick Burhans Westwind 5'11" 6lbs 11.8oz w/ 3 M3 fins (fiberglass)-
Snapped under or slightly in front of front foot. I bought this board used and rode it hard.

American Surf Solutions 5'8" 6lbs 1.8oz w/ 2 M5 fins (fiberglass)-
Deck crushed both sides of stringer under front foot for a 6-9" length. Glass never cracked through though.

I also snapped the nose of a Minami 5' 10" when I pearled in 6" of water, and completely destroyed the Bobby Z 6'4" I learned on through neglect and inexperience.


Curious Was the rusty a tufflite or no?

Looking at your board selection you're primarily riding SURF surfboards. Which aren't designed for impact AT ALL.
(excluding the SS board)

Most kite surfboards are WAY more reinforced for impact but are often times heavier than sin.

As for the SS celeritas
Ive seen a lot of broken celeritas boards they rarely survive a roll in the wind or a crashing onto shore and upon inspection appear poorly reinforced, relying on a thin skin of bamboo and glass. (although I haven't seen under the front foot. there may be structural foam there)

It appears the primary failure mode for you is Heel denting causing delamination, followed by compression buckling of the unrestrained skin resulting in the failure.

I'd definitely recommend a tuffite or "sandwhich" construction. as it creates an outer beam that reduces the point load on the underlying low density foam.

In addition
From my testing a front stomp pad has significant effect on the height from which the board can take a heel first landing without denting and I would recommend this unless you absolutely hate using one...your board sizes look too small to paddle anyway.

Your riding doesn't seem crazy so a lightweight off the shelf tufflite or "sandwich" construction with a front stomp pad would likely save you killing more boards without getting into anything custom.

If you're breaking these then I would want to see some more pics of failures to decide if you needed thicker structural foam (damaged underlying eps, causing failure) , higher density structural foam, (HD foam dented causing delamination), or more glass underneath your front foot. (foam sheared) to prevent further failures. But now we're getting heavier.

Although beautiful and good at reducing point loads when combined with sandwhich construction, for weight concerns I am not a big fan of wood venirs, from my testing I can engineer significantly more bang(literaly)/gram out of s-glass and HD foam than wood but do so at a higher price. That stated I have not tested all wood types exhaustively as initial results indicated this to be a waste of time. .


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