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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:53 pm 
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O&B
I was specifically replying to Dimitri claim that a 2% warranty at end customer is something reasonable for anything related with manufacturing.

As I do not know about electronic consumer goods, as those examples given by Dimitri, I used something I know more about.

As such it was not about the complexity, size, technological power, etc. between both industries & the products they sell. But believe me that the main difference is not some use injection moulding machines from outer space, plastic moulds made out of gold, secret raw materials or operators with PhDs in astrophysics; for plastic parts & simple assemblies facilities and tooling, at the shop floor, there are probably more similarities than differences.

Now, if you find reasonable a 2% failure rate at the end customer for any failure mode that has the potential to put people in the hospital I am fine with it.

I do not & I do hope Dimitri does not share your thoughts.


Last edited by Tiago1973 on Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:48 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:35 pm 
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Tiago. There is little point into getting into a discussion with O&B when it comes to Epic products, whether he is in the employ of Epic or whether he just idolises Dimitri so much that he will spend huge amounts of time defending his company is unclear but it is futile.

The Epic bar, both old and new is one of if not the worst looking bar that I have seen at the beach, it looks like something from early 2000. I would never put my faith in something that looks so cheap and that after a few sessions has rust marks on the bar from the posidrive screws that go through it.

The kites are good for the budget but I would recommend that people find an alternative bar until Epic come up with something decent.


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:42 pm 
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Oldndisliken wrote:
your comparison is apples to potatoes.
kiting may seem super duper extreme, but it's not.
take up power walking.
I am the Epic :stop: :redcard: police and referee


:bye:


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:56 pm 
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Location: Save a life...adopt a Pitbull
I am speaking about the kiteboarding industry in general.
Epic is the example used here, but I think this goes all the way across.
I agree the numbers should be better than than 2%.
I did the math on Dimitri's numbers, as it relates to the bar system that is the title of this thread.
The number is less than .4% according to the actual number of problem units that Dimitri quoted versus the number Epic has sold.
Dimitri's estimate is a loose number he threw out, it is actually much less when you do the math.

I was involved with a lot of hard and soft plastics molding, Davenport screw machine parts, Acme screw machine parts, CNC sheet metal production work, CNC laser metal cutting, wire and cable manufacturing for live music and lighting purposes, tooling and mold making, production soldering, metals plating, industrial metals painting and several other general manufacturing processes from 1975-1992. I was then involved with a company that was exploring the ISO 9000 certification process, so I am aware that there is no magic.

But it is a far, far cry from making plastic parts for General Motors/Toyota/Volvo than making them for Ozone/Epic/Nobile.

I still believe that the gear in kiting works pretty well..to piddle around on the water at 20 mph.
I've seen way more problems arise from a lack of knowledge of the gear, lack of proper maintenance and upkeep, lack of proper adjustment, and an over inflated sense of ability and control that leads to a disregard for safe kiting practices and accidents....and a tendency to blame the gear when they happen.

KLK- Your forum account was created in April of this year for the sole purpose of trolling Epic.
Your first post was to ask a question that was not a question,
...so you could voice your opinion that the Epic kites look like every other kite to you.
Your second post to criticize Dimitri, then talk about how the Epic bar looks to you.
Third post to criticize me, and repeat yourself about how the bar looks.
You've made three posts total...all priceless gems of contribution to the forum.

Caesar- I'm responding directly to Tiago and we are having a conversation.
Supa just pulls his dick out and jacks off every time I post anything.

Supa- Same old emoticon filled..crazy..crazy..stalker..nonsense.
Change those words to fit the strange reality inside your brain.


Last edited by Oldnbroken on Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:23 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:24 pm 
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Oldnbakenbacon wrote:
I have a tendency to blame others when i fukkup .
I am just negative noise.


:wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:44 pm 
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Oldnbroken wrote:
I agree the numbers should be better than than 2%.

Glad we agree, for a moment I was in a different dimension or something...

Oldnbroken wrote:
Dimitri's estimate is a loose number he threw out, it is actually much less when you do the math.

Could be. My comments were done taken into consideration the data as provided by Dimitri.

Oldnbroken wrote:
But it is a far, far cry to produce plastic parts for General Motors or Toyota than it is for Ozone, Epic, Nobile Kites etc.

well.. it is probably a far cry to produce plastic parts for Toyota than it is for General Motors. lol


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 12:14 am 
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Location: Save a life...adopt a Pitbull
We have a GM plant in Dallas Texas and a Toyota plant in San Antonio Texas ..both producing full sized Pick-Up Trucks/SUV's.
GM/ is adding 500 IT jobs in Austin this year.
The Chevy/GMC pick-ups are great vehicles and cost less than the Toyota's for the equivalent truck.
Pretty hard to go wrong with any pick-up made in America, even if it has a Japanese name on it.
I've never owned a Japanese vehicle.
But I have to admit....my wife's car is German. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 1:16 am 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
Quote:
Tiago. There is little point into getting into a discussion with O&B when it comes to Epic products, whether he is in the employ of Epic or whether he just idolises Dimitri so much that he will spend huge amounts of time defending his company is unclear but it is futile.
The Epic bar, both old and new is one of if not the worst looking bar that I have seen at the beach, it looks like something from early 2000. I would never put my faith in something that looks so cheap and that after a few sessions has rust marks on the bar from the posidrive screws that go through it.
The kites are good for the budget but I would recommend that people find an alternative bar until Epic come up with something decent.

Once again Mr.KLK we can't make every body happy. Their is a lot of kiters that do love the 2011 bar. And wait until they get the 4G BAR with the new EPIC Chicken Loop in their hands.
Today was a crazy day in the ocean. It was blowing 18 to 38 mph very gusty and in the sound it was blowing 27 to 42 mph.
We had at least 3 kiters demoing the new BAR and the new SCREAMERS. And from what I heard they were very impressed with the kites and the bar.


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 2:24 pm 
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Oldnexcavating wrote:

KLK- Your forum account was created in April of this year.
Your first post was to ask a question that was not a question,
...so you could add your opinion that the Epic kites look like every other kite.
Your second post to give critical advise to Dimitri, then talk about how the Epic bar looks to you.
Third post to criticize me, and reiterate your thoughts about how the bar looks.
You've made three posts total, all priceless gems of contribution to the forum.
Does this leave anybody wondering what is your purpose as KLK?



digging and hollowing out as usual :duh:


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 Post subject: Re: Blade/Epic chicken loop release
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:57 pm 
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Location: Save a life...adopt a Pitbull
SupaEZ wrote:
I'm waiting with bated breath on every word Oldnbroken writes.. as usual.
I think I may be in love with him. :prayer:
The stalking is flattering...but a little gay. :cheer:


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