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 Post subject: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DLX
PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 7:11 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 6:43 pm
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I've recently become interested in the sport of kitesurfing, and now I want to start learning to control a kite with a trainer kite.

A friend that is experience with kitesurfing steered me to the Ocean Rodeo React, since it is a 4 line kite that should respond similarly to a full size kite.

While looking into that, I found references to the Flysurfer Viron 2 DLX, which seems to be another 4 line option, but possibly higher quality?

I'm hoping someone with experience with both products could provide some information about the two.

Is the Viron worth the added expense? Are the lines and bar reusable with a full size kite?

The Viron comes in a 6m size with an "Infinity Bar". Is that too big to use as a trainer? (I'm about 180 lbs and average fitness.)

Any advice would be useful. Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:27 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:05 pm
Posts: 202
I don't know the Flysurfer one...looking at their site, seems to be a 4-line trainer too.
I have the Ocean Rodeo Rise 2m, which is the version prior to the React. I think it's the same though....a scaled down version of their big kite (probably a Prodigy).
If the Flysurfer is a foil, maybe the choice will come down to if you plan to fly SLE or foil type kites.
But I bet both would work.

The key thing is ability to depower. This is where 2-line trainers have very limited training capabilities, because they do not mimic the behaviour of a normal big size kite.

I would suggest if you are using this as a training tool that you use a full size bar and lines. That way you get oriented to the same control system you'll use on the big kite, can practice the safeties, and by the time you're ready to move on it's second nature.

I wrote out a bunch of trainer kite suggestions on another thread: http://www.kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2387686&p=874065 This was the trainer kite program my "kite mentor" laid out for me. Have fun! :D


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:53 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 6:07 pm
Posts: 149
Hi, I do not have experience with the Flysurfer but I do with the React.

I use 2 different kites for beginner trainer kites depending on wind speed. I use the React and also an Ozone 4m UNO. The UNO is more expensive since you nee to buy a bar and a harness in addition to the kite. The React comes with a bar and the bag is a makeshift trainer kite harness. I'll use the React if the winds are above 15 mph since it works well in that range and above and it is not to powerful. It does come with a 4-line bar that is de-powerable so you get the feel of a larger LEI. It's a good little kite and we have even used it to land buggy in winds up to 37mph without any kite distortion issues. Although I do not suggest you use it as a trainer in those winds!!!! Very simple kite to use on land/snow also.

The UNO 4 is a great kite too but a much bigger investment you'll need to get a real bar to go along with it. Then that bar is usable on any LEI you may get in the future. It's quite a bit more powerful than the React so I use it in lighter winds as a trainer. The UNO also doubles as a really high wind surf kite but that will be a long ways down the road for you. You will need to get a harness to go along with it too.

hope that helps


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 9:27 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 410
Location: XL Kites.com
Disclaimer: I sell these and many other brands of kites.

Marrus,
First of all, welcome to kiteboarding! Good to see that you're doing your homework first before just jumping in. Trainer kites are one of the best ways to ease your way into kiting. I have not used the Flysurfer, but I've flown the React quite a bit. I also have used the Slingshot B3 even more. I think that like juandesooka said, it will mostly depend on what type of kite you intend on using: Foil or Inflatable. Without getting TOO deep, here are the pros/cons:

Foil (Flysurfer):
Pro: Works well in lighter winds b/c it weighs very little; more resilient to crashes b/c there's no internal structures (bladders) to rupture; good power relative to size.
Cons:Tends to "taco" in light winds and fall down; set up is completely opposite from the way most kiteboarding kites (inflatables) are set up; will float for only a short time before becoming waterlogged; need to buy your harness in order to try it out "hooked in"; relaunch is unlike a relaunch for inflatables.

Inflatable (React):
Pro:Depowerable by pushing out on the bar; relaunching it off the water is exactly the same way you relaunch an inflatable big enough to ride; set up is exactly the same as a full size kite; carrying bag actually transforms into a harness for flying the react; React comes with a $50 gift certificate towards a lesson that any OR dealer will honor.
Cons: If you can't quit slamming this kite into the ground, you may eventually rupture the bladder (this may be a hint that maybe you should take up golf instead :wink: ); not as powerful as the foil.

I didn't keep that as short as I'd hoped, but maybe it will help you sort it out. Bottom line: if you think that you're going to be an inflatable rider like 99% of kiteboarders, then I would pick the React. If you think that you're going to be a foil rider, then I'd pick the Flysurfer.

Either way, getting a trainer kite and flying the crap out of it until you're able to control it instinctively is a great start. Getting lessons from there on before buying any gear is the next best step. Good Luck! :thumb:

EDIT: Nicely put, Coloradokiter!


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 9:44 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 6:43 pm
Posts: 8
Thanks everyone.

I didn't mention it in my OP but I actually already have the Ocean Rodeo React. It arrived right before the blizzard we had here on the east coast, so I haven't unpacked it yet and still have some time to return it if I felt there was a compelling reason to switch gears to the Viron.

But since I definitely do intend to go with an inflatable big kite, the Ocean Rodeo definitely sounds like the best starting point right now.

Sadly there aren't any instructors close to me that I'm aware of that accept the OR coupon. I'm in Suffolk County, NY (aka eastern Long Island).


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:52 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2014 10:33 pm
Posts: 25
Ya go with the OR React, scaled down version of a real SLE kite and not too big to get u in trouble. If you use the bar they give you the lines are shorter (lighter)and actually allow you to fly in in sub 15 knot winds.
I learned like Juan, on a 2m rise and it was great.


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 11:34 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 6:43 pm
Posts: 8
I had a chance to try out the React today. Definitely a nice product, although it was way too cold and windy here to get much flying time in.

One question came up, though. The tab at the end of the center line ends directly on the velcro eject cuff, so it isn't possible to slip it through the D ring like this video shows.

Could someone explain (or better yet, link a video showing) how the eject cuff is supposed to clip onto the D ring?

Thanks!

Attachment:
Ocean Rodeo React Eject Cuff.jpg
Ocean Rodeo React Eject Cuff.jpg [ 60.05 KIB | Viewed 413 times ]


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2015 12:07 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 410
Location: XL Kites.com
Marrus,
The cuff should be wrapped snugly around itself, with the "finger" sticking out the bottom. Put the finger through the D-Ring, fold it over, then insert the end of the finger back up into the cuff. Does that make sense? For some reason, in your picture it appears that the cuff is completely unrolled. It's just velcroed, so no harm done, just confusing at first. Let me know if that doesn't make sense and I can try and send you a video clip of me doing it here in the shop. :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2015 12:18 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 6:43 pm
Posts: 8
The part that is confusing me is that there is nothing that I would call a finger on the nylon strap that is attached to the middle lines. The strap is attached to the lines on one end, and sewn directly to the cuff on the other end.

I did try looping the nylon strap through the D ring then folding it over and cuffing it, but that comes undone when it's pulled from the kite end of the line, which my friend said doesn't sound right.

If you have the time and inclination to put together a video showing the right way to attach the strap to the D ring, that would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Trainer Kites: Ocean Rodeo React vs Flysurfer Viron 2 DL
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 8:25 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 410
Location: XL Kites.com
Can you take a couple of better pictures so we can see exactly what you've got going on there? I'm expecting someone from OR might be along directly... :wink:


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