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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:03 am 
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I think grunt mens the kite that pulls like a train. Normally associated with park and ride low aspect kites like deltas. Lots of power on the bar. The opposite of high aspect c kite that generate power by apparent wind and not by just pulling the bar in.


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:00 pm 
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I suppose I differentiate between grunt through a low aspect kite that pulls you down wind or more down wind to be accurate and static grunt, which is like what I experience on the zephyr and dyno which when you pull in the bar although kite sits back a little it is still hunting the front of the window.

How do you explain an edge, which still pulls like a train, but it pulls you upwind with the right edging and the pull translates into immense speed.

Mmm not sure.


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:29 pm 
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Location: The Naki
when I go to the beach and discover the wind is light I let out a grunt of dismay.

"Huuuughhhn"

thus low end grunt.


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:48 pm 
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It is a monster, usually found at the shallow, or low, end of a pool.


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:50 pm 
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A kite is grunty when you can hear its grunt.

Only low end grunt is important, because you can actually hear the kite's grunt only when the apparent wind is really light.

The apparent wind is light only when the rider is static or moving very slowly. That's why low end grunt is a synonim of light wind static pull.

But don't be mistaken: static refers to the rider, not the kite. In the fun sizes, most of the grunt will come from the kite's movement.

What makes a grunty kite?
A combination of a deep profile and low aspect ratio.

Race kites are not grunty kites. They are high L/D, and thus shallow profile and high aspect kites.
They pull at higher apparent wind speeds, and do not move much.

You cannot hear their grunt.


Last edited by lobodomar on Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:02 pm 
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It means bar pressure.

If you said a kite had medium to high bar pressure, some people would like it and some people would say they want light bar pressure. So they call it "grunt," ...it's a gray area. Who doesn't like grunt? Grunt is good, right? That means the kite gives you feedback...like a race car.

Marketing.


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:18 pm 
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Yep, it's used as a marketing tool, since there's so much misunderstanding involved.

But it's also a real thing, which makes certain kites more or less apt for certain riding styles.

Bar pressure is marketing. But it's also the pressure (or force) at the bar fully sheeted in with the rider static and the kite at noon at a certain wind speed. You can measure it with a dynamometer.


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 5:57 pm 
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I dont think Ive ever read an add for a kite that makes mention of "grunt" It's rider lingo, and not found in copy other than maybe test results. Companies will never associate their gear with something that could be synonymous with taking a dump!

And it aint bar pressure or an actual noise!!!! Holy crap, I though it was a simple question with a simple answer but throw enough kiters in a fish pond and nothing is simple!


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:05 pm 
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well may be once some of the lite-weight test riders had an unfortunate involuntary release of fecal matter during the testing of low aspect fuller wing profile kites in the gusty wind conditions...
hence the synonym?


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 Post subject: Re: what is low end grunt?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:17 pm 
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Starsky wrote:
I dont think Ive ever read an add for a kite that makes mention of "grunt" It's rider lingo, and not found in copy other than maybe test results. Companies will never associate their gear with something that could be synonymous with taking a dump!
...

I hear it mentioned a lot with respect to slingshot kites. Other companies may use it as well, but you can see dozens of examples if you google "slingshot low end grunt."

And while it is not linked directly to the SS domain, the "ad copy" is identical at many of these sites selling the gear. If you dig I think the source in this case is the company. But yeah, it may have started with rider lingo. In the end, most riders know what it means even if we describe it differently. It's going to pull! I don't think of shitting. What'd you have for lunch?
;)


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