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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:55 pm 
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It's a matter of safety for the beginners,kite sites preservation for future,public image etc... hope everyone can understand that and do whatever right to save all of us.Strangely, we had an incompetence IKO instructor came in our spot one day and tell us what we should do and don't then he teach his students kiting 2 kite lengths close to people beach houses while wind blowing 20+ !!!
We've been playing in our beach day in,day out for years then suddenly some outside douchebag want to mess with us?!? .. We ganged up n bullying that jerk out of our beach for good.
Stupidity + bad attitude = problems/troubles


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:12 am 
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I would class myself as an experienced and competent kitesurfer, but how do you think I got all that experience? Mainly by putting up kites that are are too big, having kite mares are and doing stupid things. There is a part of learning to kite surf that you cannot teach and although you should never let a newbie obviously endanger themselves they have to experience things for themselves. It's all very good to criticise people's decisions on a forum but in reality we've all been there both as a beginner and as experienced kiters.

Re the last post, why was the instructor incompetent?! Did you know the level of his students? Did you know what part of the course he was doing? I see "competent experienced" kitesurfers kiting well with 2 line lengths of obstacles at pretty every beach I've ever been to :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:10 pm 
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tautologies wrote:
and the kite promptly ended in the tree...we were all told to fuck off by the guy.

Atleast there were not many other people at the beach..


Ha ha... hope you rubbed it in his face we he ended up in the tree!


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:30 am 
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JGTR wrote:
....Re the last post, why was the instructor incompetent?! Did you know the level of his students? Did you know what part of the course he was doing? I see "competent experienced" kitesurfers kiting well with 2 line lengths of obstacles at pretty every beach I've ever been to :lol:


Re the last post, why was the instructor incompetent?!

:lol: Failed to adequately assess local condition,by letting students hold their kite in +20mph wind near people houses is very obvious sign for disaster. Talk about lawsuits from rich home owners here then the City can say no more kiting activities for everyone.Sorry,no hard feeling,but we had to intervene.Yes,we can do a kiteloop there safely,but please not for beginners.

Did you know the level of his students?

Easily at a glance on how they hold the kite and deal with power. You can spot them,can't you ? (since you classed yourself as an experienced and competent kitesurfer)

Did you know what part of the course he was doing?

Do we really have to know?For all these things above plus his arrogant attitude,we can safely say this guy is incompetent. He gets circled by our local guys and haven't seen him back since.

We don't even self claim "competent experienced" ,but we do our tricks comfortably couple kite lengths of obstacles just for regular fun ,perhaps we made it look easy for beginners who want to try it too....Whatever...,you will pay your due for gaining experiences but not at the price of shutting down our kite beach.


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 7:30 am 
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this probably won't help but
"whose at fault"?
beginner, kiters on the beach, instructor, other....?

no one is at fault, people are idiots,
creative but idiots.

it does not matter what they are doing at the moment,
thats just the way it is, sorry but look around.....


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:49 pm 
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aircatcher wrote:
JGTR wrote:
....Re the last post, why was the instructor incompetent?! Did you know the level of his students? Did you know what part of the course he was doing? I see "competent experienced" kitesurfers kiting well with 2 line lengths of obstacles at pretty every beach I've ever been to :lol:


Re the last post, why was the instructor incompetent?!

:lol: Failed to adequately assess local condition,by letting students hold their kite in +20mph wind near people houses is very obvious sign for disaster. Talk about lawsuits from rich home owners here then the City can say no more kiting activities for everyone.Sorry,no hard feeling,but we had to intervene.Yes,we can do a kiteloop there safely,but please not for beginners.

Did you know the level of his students?

Easily at a glance on how they hold the kite and deal with power. You can spot them,can't you ? (since you classed yourself as an experienced and competent kitesurfer)

Did you know what part of the course he was doing?

Do we really have to know?For all these things above plus his arrogant attitude,we can safely say this guy is incompetent. He gets circled by our local guys and haven't seen him back since.

We don't even self claim "competent experienced" ,but we do our tricks comfortably couple kite lengths of obstacles just for regular fun ,perhaps we made it look easy for beginners who want to try it too....Whatever...,you will pay your due for gaining experiences but not at the price of shutting down our kite beach.



So its ok for you to do your tricks within 2 line lengths of people's houses but not for supervised beginners??? Good job you don't proclaim "competent experienced", "hypocritical bullies" sounds more appropriate :rollgrin:

If you were really that bothered about safety you would surely lead by example - kitelooping in front of houses is really not the best way to encourage safe kiting at your spot no matter how experienced you are.


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 8:17 pm 
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"JGTR wrote:"
So its ok for you to do your tricks within 2 line lengths of people's houses but not for supervised beginners??? Good job you don't proclaim "competent experienced", "hypocritical bullies" sounds more appropriate :rollgrin:
If you were really that bothered about safety you would surely lead by example - kitelooping in front of houses is really not the best way to encourage safe kiting at your spot no matter how experienced you are
.

You are trying to generalize everybody incompetent regardless their skills and experience.How much you really know about safety when you actually haven't got the skills or sense for local conditions.

So its ok for you to do your tricks within 2 line lengths of people's houses but not for supervised beginners???

Of course,done it thousand times in complete control with power n space clearance.Not recommended for beginners though,a baby can't run without learning to walk baby steps.first. and if an adult trying to make a 1 year old run as he can then his teaching skill is very questionable or he is retarded.(one guy called the school owner about this beginners supervisor.Case closed next day ! )

Good job you don't proclaim "competent experienced", "hypocritical bullies" sounds more appropriate :rollgrin

:P Call whatever you like:,but we have saved our kite beach for more than 10 years with self policing so that tourist or outside travel kiters like you can come and safely enjoy this beautiful place.
Likes knotwindy said"... it does not matter what they are doing at the moment,
thats just the way it is, sorry but look around
....." It likes that here most of the time,too.
But there's a time.we just can't sit and watch some real douchebag come in and wreck our play ground.


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:41 pm 
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Quote:
You are trying to generalize everybody incompetent regardless their skills and experience.How much you really know about safety when you actually haven't got the skills or sense for local conditions.


No I'm saying the opposite!

You appear to believe that experienced kiters don't have accidents, you kitelooping right in front of a house and then moaning about learners practising in the exact same spot makes you a hypocrite, too close to an obstacle is too close whether you are a beginner or experienced rider -the most serious accidents I have seen have been the more experienced riders.


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 1:49 pm 
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http://spikiteboarding.com/kitespots_safetyrules.html

Good set of rules, I like this one:

"Fishing boats and jet skis are fast, often intoxicated, and deadly silent when approaching from downwind – keep your eyes open for them."


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 Post subject: Re: beginner accident ...who is at fault...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:08 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:54 am
Posts: 297
Location: Como Lake - Italy
IMO, the problems sometimes comes from the "feeling" a beginner has of his experience level. In my home spot, the sequence is quite always the same: base course, then 4/5 days practice in a kite paradise with flat water, steady wind and plenty of space. Then back home on the lake, a tricky launching site with bystanders, trees and any sort of obstacles, gusty and unpredictable wind near the shore. At that point, it's rare that the beginners will shout "hey guys, be careful and help me, I'm a beginner" since he actually thinks he can ride exactly like he was riding in the kite paradise. The rest is story: after the crash, the beginner says "my God, how could this happen? I've been riding for 10 days in XXXX and everything was perfect, I was going upwind very well and I've also changed direction 2 or 3 times..."


Last edited by pmaggie on Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:13 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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