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 Post subject: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:13 pm 
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I came up with a new self launch system made of a surplus safety leash, paracord, carabiners, and some bungees. Took about an hour to make with items readily available.

[EDIT:
I think I made a stupid mistake: the bungees does not increase load force, all force is controlled by the release handle.The bungees still serve the purpase of taking up some slack before releasing. How to increase load forces beyond that?
]

Essentially it is a leash that releases automatically on load, but still flags the kite.

The assembled system ready for launch:

Image

If the kite starts to launch prematurely, the system should release and flag the kite before an anchor is overloaded:

Image


This solves the problem of weak anchors loosing the kite easily, and solid anchors becoming really dangerous if they can't hold anyway.

I added captions to each image in a photo sequence in the link below explaining things in more detail. The last pictures shows a launch with a less safe suicide setup.

https://picasaweb.google.com/115960953431962890354/SaferSelfLaunch

Note that the red section is a standard self land / launch rope that is good to have around separately. The yellow section is the optional auto flagging system.


Warning: system only tested by pulling the bar, no kite has been launched with it yet. Load force may have to be adjusted. Suggestions are welcome. Use at own risk.


Last edited by icebird on Tue Sep 03, 2013 2:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:23 pm 
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I like your ingenuity :thumb: Just looks a bit over-complicated for my taste.

If I'm self launching and it's sketchy, I just attach the safety to a separate object - so if the main anchor gets dragged it flags itself.


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:23 pm 
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lotta lines in there..I dont get how it works....


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:38 pm 
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NYKiter wrote:
lotta lines in there..I dont get how it works....


when the bungee stretches, the yellow handle is pulled similar to a normal safety leash. This breaks the connection to the chickenloop. Then the thin line connects directly from the anchor to the kite safety line.

@goose - yes it looks a bit busy, but pulls easily out of a bag and attaches with a few biners - I like to have the red section seperately, this isn't something you necessarily want to use in all cases. Part of the leash line is actually not needed, but was simpler to keep.


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 2:41 pm 
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I see how it works and I think it's a great idea. It doesn't look like it would flag the kite out though. I would think if that much force is applied to rip the anchor out, the kite is not sitting at the edge but rather the bar was engaged due to negligence of slack line wrapping around it when setting the kite out in the wind. If that happened, wouldn't you need a much longer bungee so that the safety could travel far enough to actually flag out the kite. Or is it enough to do the 20% depower the original blade and epic bars released?


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 3:25 pm 
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local kiter jeff uses a system with two dog anchors. first dog anchor is normal, second is attached to flag out system. If first anchor is pulled because of failed launch the kite flags.

i think a simpler system is get a small hair tie bungee or two rubber bands, something that will break with about ten pounds of force, hook that to the chicken loop and then attach it to the dog anchor. Now attach the flag out to the dog anchor. If there is too much force the hair tie bungee breaks, and it flags out.

Not real sure I understand where all the lines are going in the above system looks complicated.


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:33 pm 
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PVITfrumBYRAM wrote:
I see how it works and I think it's a great idea. It doesn't look like it would flag the kite out though.


When the chickenloop moves about 30 cm away it will hae stretched the bungees and to move further it needs to generate the force needed to pull a standard safety leash.

When the kite builds this amount of power, it will release release the yellow handle. The carabiner and the floater will hang complete loose.

What is left is a secondary carabiner attached to the safety leash of the kite. This carabiner goes from the safety leash through a strong paracord to the anchor and will flag out the kite if it attempts to move away from the anchor.

The good thing about this solution is that it all happens it fairly low forces, so the situation is defused before any serious tension is built up.

The problem I discovered is that the bungees do not enable the kite to pull stronger before the release - but the bungees do add some needed movement before releasing. I'd like to be able to allow the kite to pull harder before release, but that is complicated.


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:36 pm 
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Hi Icebird,

did you see flysurfers new self-launching system on the Cronix?
I think that's much safer than the "chicken-loop fix somewhere" tecnique.

You can see it here at 1:55:
http://vimeo.com/72885911

Image

Cheers,
Herbert


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:37 pm 
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edt wrote:
local kiter jeff uses a system with two dog anchors. first dog anchor is normal, second is attached to flag out system. If first anchor is pulled because of failed launch the kite flags.

Or you could use a small weight for flagging - I think both a good options. However, if the main anchor goes, it will go with significant force and may hit someone regardless of the kite flagging.
I wanted to avoid that - for instance in a tight spot with beach users further downwind.
At the same time, this system is simple to use in the sense that you need just clip it into a single anchor and to the kite.

edt wrote:
i think a simpler system is get a small hair tie bungee or two rubber bands, something that will break with about ten pounds of force, hook that to the chicken loop and then attach it to the dog anchor. Now attach the flag out to the dog anchor. If there is too much force the hair tie bungee breaks, and it flags out.

Yes, I also thought about a fuse system. It is essentially the same idea, only this easily reassembled. It may be a fuse system is better in the end. Both have the advantage of not allowing too much tension on the anchor.


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 Post subject: Re: Auto flagging Self Launch
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:46 pm 
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Location: Ford Lake, Michigan
fuse system is cheaper too. 300 pack of goodie hair ties $6, of which in ten years you might use 30 in failed launches if you kite all the time like me, I guess that's 60 cents has to be less expensive than your contraption. Fuse has another advantage if you want to teach a noob how to use it, more likely he won't screw it up and hurt himself by rigging it wrong. Can't really rig a fuse wrong. Not sure how much I like the double dog anchor it sometimes saves the kite but can still throw the dog anchor at you or the kite. Maybe it's good for someone with quick reflexes. It would be nice if you could simplify your system somehow.


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