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 Post subject: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:57 am 
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A thread was started on the Australian forum to discuss this issue after a kiter was dragged through power lines and ended up on the roof of a house. It's not appropriate to fill the accident thread with blame and finger pointing.

http://www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kite ... l/Lofting/

From that thread:
Quote:
The question is, how do people get lofted with modern gear? Is it extreme conditions, gear failure, or user error, or all of the above? I thought the risk of lofting had been designed out of kites with the advent of bow kites.

In the C kite days we used to see people getting dragged across roads and through power lines all the time. It was almost a weekly occurrence. You could drive past beaches and count the repairs to the power lines. I personally witnessed at least 4 power line cutting, roof landing drags.


What are your thoughts?


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 6:10 am 
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Over-powered and then the gusts come in. Panic, pull the bar accidentally and off you go. Or a lull drop the kite back into the power zone, then it powers up in a gust and off you go.

Seen a few guys yanked over the beach; self-launch went wrong and a couple of learners looping and supermanning.

I've been out a few times when just sheeting the bar would lift me off the ground - paraglider weather. Great fun when it's consistent but when it's gusty like it was on Monday, I slowly and carefully get the kite to the edge of the window and low, and get it the hell out of the sky.


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:22 am 
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Location: Como Lake - Italy
IMO, basically, overpowered. Maybe a sudden gust but it's rare and it normally happens in already dangerous weather conditions, i.e. an approaching storm, a "strange wind" that is not the usual one of the spot, a very gusty situation and so on. I've never seen someone (correctly powered) lofted or dragged through power lines in standard good weather conditions. I saw little accidents near the beach, the classic beginner pulling the bar instead of releasing or a self lauch went wrong but all of these accidents were "minor" ones, not deadly lofting or dragging.
But, here we are again, "it is the only size I own" it's (potentially deadly) common on the beach...


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:35 am 
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IMO it is the industry's + instructors' to blame for giving newbies too much confidence in the gear.


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 10:15 am 
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Jdude wrote:
IMO it is the industry's + instructors' to blame for giving newbies too much confidence in the gear.


Yeah yeah blame the instructors, do you actually have 2 brain cells to rub together??

Since when did u see instructors teaching riding overpowered with kites that are too big, tricking right next to the beach, dangerous self launching and landing, riding too close to obstacles, riding helmet less, riding too close to other riders..........

Look in the mirror, it's the "expert" or so called "competent" riders that blame everyone else for bad standards yet fail to realise that unless they lead by example nothing will improve.


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 12:27 pm 
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Location: Miami @ 6" Flat Butter!
Jdude wrote:
IMO it is the industry's + instructors' to blame for giving newbies too much confidence in the gear.
I don't think so :nono:
That's incoherence when somebody is overriding their coherence with fantasy
and becomes toxic as you see the result :!:

DrLW


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 12:52 pm 
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JGTR wrote:
Since when did u see instructors teaching riding overpowered with kites that are too big, tricking right next to the beach, dangerous self launching and landing, riding too close to obstacles, riding helmet less, riding too close to other riders..........

Look in the mirror, it's the "expert" or so called "competent" riders that blame everyone else for bad standards yet fail to realise that unless they lead by example nothing will improve.

I don't see the connection between being lofted on the beach and stunting close to shore...


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:16 pm 
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Location: Norfolk, UK
Everyone's got to do the drills...

On land the kite should be at 10 or 2 o'clock...

If something happens be ready to release the safety....

If something really bad happens be ready to release the kite....

I recently fully released a death looping kite as it dragged me towards some steel and stone groynes.... I was not happy watching the kite fly away....but I was very happy about not being lofted onto or dragged into something really nasty. As it was the kite flew over the obstacles and got caught in some gorse bushes and dunes. Everything...with a bit of care...was undamaged.

Everyone does get blasé because the kites have much greater wind ranges than they used to. But you've still go to be prepared to make an instant decision to cut loose.

There is...in fact...a pretty good argument that if you're handling a kite on land you should not be hooked in at all....other than via the safety. After all....if a big gust pulls it out of your hands it has probably saved you from being lofted.


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:28 pm 
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balugh wrote:
Everyone's got to do the drills...

On land the kite should be at 10 or 2 o'clock...

If something happens be ready to release the safety....

If something really bad happens be ready to release the kite....

I recently fully released a death looping kite as it dragged me towards some steel and stone groynes.... I was not happy watching the kite fly away....but I was very happy about not being lofted onto or dragged into something really nasty. As it was the kite flew over the obstacles and got caught in some gorse bushes and dunes. Everything...with a bit of care...was undamaged.

Everyone does get blasé because the kites have much greater wind ranges than they used to. But you've still go to be prepared to make an instant decision to cut loose.

There is...in fact...a pretty good argument that if you're handling a kite on land you should not be hooked in at all....other than via the safety. After all....if a big gust pulls it out of your hands it has probably saved you from being lofted.

Some people are just not going to "throw away" their $3000 kite. I can hear them thinking "I can still save it!" as they go flying across the beach...

The key is experience... knowing when the shit is going to hit the fan and your odds of saving it are not in your favor and throwing the QR - BEFORE the "something bad happens."


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 Post subject: Re: Lofting/Deadly Dragging
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:37 pm 
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hope the fellow get´s well.

seem it was linked with some poor choices, probably linked with unexperience

in the lack of regulation/licensing a bit of localism goes a long way


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