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Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

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diegowhite
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby diegowhite » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:47 pm

Again where have I said bodybuilding? I said combination of building muscle size and overall strength is best and Bodyweight circuits are an inferior tool. I'd put Bodyweight work in there as well but it would be the least important tool. If you have research to the contrary if be interested in reading it

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Larse
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby Larse » Sat Jul 12, 2014 5:40 pm

Muscle size just says body building in my book.

My exercises that I just posted are good for strength also. Just do them less explosive and then you'll hit 8-12rm. If you do them right... I haven't said anything about bodyweight exercises is the best either ;) I said functional... I use weights on almost all of my exercises. But I agree;The program I posted today is very technical and takes alot of practice to do perfect. With sloppy technique they are not very hard. But with good technique they are very tough.

But sure, if you want bigger muscles it's good to isolate muscles, but if you want them to function correct, you should work larger muscle chains.

So do you think bigger muscles are better, if they can't perform in a large full body movement like you do in a freestyle trick, or would you prefer smaller muscles that functions perfekt and contract faster to make that last rotation and pass before landing?

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Larse
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby Larse » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:20 pm

I have a book. It's the ABC of fascia and training. Muscle chains/nerve parhways. I can't remember the author and I can't find the book... I'll look for it...

diegowhite
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby diegowhite » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:31 pm

I don't know where you are getting lost in translation. I never mentioned using any exercises working to isolate muscles. On the contrary I am talking about mainly full body movements which build both muscle strength and size.

And yes I do believe bigger (and don't go jumping to conclusions that I am talking huge) muscles which can perform large fully body movements in tricks fast are better than smaller muscles which can perform the same but are weaker.

Don't buy into old myths which say big muscles are slow or weak or less inflexible than smaller ones.

I see where you are coming from thinking that the pro's train explosive movements to execute tricks faster but the main progress they get is when they practice those tricks on the water in real conditions. The rider with most time on the water practicing tricks will be the better rider not the guy who has spent most his time in the gym training explosively. Yes those exercises will help somewhat to achieving more explosiveness but it is very hard to argue how much more benefit that will be.

The most important thing to most kiters (and even pro's) is to stay on the water and be able to ride and the main thing that stops them is injury or pain. Look at a lot of the guys who are not competing are because of blown ACLs not because they weren't explosive enough. So how do you prevent that? Isolate to circuits using complicated exercises such as you suggest OR make the person as strong, agile and flexible as possible using simple basic big movements as a base and supplementing with bodyweight work, stretching etc.

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Larse
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby Larse » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:53 pm

I guess we agree then, don't we? :) Functional exercises with about 8-12 repetition max? Some a little more isolated than others. That's all about what my training guide contains...

And for freestyle, yes, they need more explosive power. So we also agree on that :)

I know larger muscles are faster. All I'm saying is that you have to train the correct muscle chains and recruitment paterns as in kiteboarding. My exercises will also make you stronger and your muscles a little larger. The program I posted was just the one I did today. I don't always do circuit training lile this, so don't pay special attention to that.

I can't find the book i mentioned (some one boroughed it), but here are some good articles with studies fascial training (muscle chains):

http://www.acefitness.org/certifiednews ... rk-part-1/


http://www.acefitness.org/certifiednews ... rk-part-2/

This explains my point of view about functional training. Training this way will make you stronger in a full body movement and it will also lower risk of injury. And make tour muscles grow a bit.

diegowhite
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby diegowhite » Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:44 pm

Cheers, I'll take a look at those this week.

I think we agree in principle I just believe you could have applied simpler programming to your workouts: train heavy squats, deadlifts, pushes and pulls. Work on single leg, rotation, anti-rotation...and then get more complicated exercises on weak/lagging areas

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Larse
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby Larse » Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:01 pm

Yes :) I could add some heavier exercises in there. But I like to take the more functional aprouch. Check out Thomas Myers Anatomy Trains :) - that's my missing book :)

I have some heavy leg exercises in the training guide as well. But often with fascial back line in mind. Like one leg death lift or one arm chest press. I do those with heavy weights as well. I do all my exercises with 15 repitations max. Often less...

And there are many rotation/antirotation exercises in there. Core is really important for all athletes :)

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Larse
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby Larse » Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:11 pm

But it's important to get the technique right before going heavy in my exercises. So in the beginning people wil get more endurence, coordination, core strength, balance og cardio. And when they get good at the exercises they will increase muscle mass and strength :)

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ShaveTheWhales
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby ShaveTheWhales » Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:29 am

Raueda1

Ok - without goin into type1 and type 2 fibre training systems, what every one has missed is your hydration levels - prior to kiteing...
You mention missed landings and slower reactions - 2% loss of body fluid through exertion, urine & excretion makes the brain tired and lethargic, minor cramps, sound familiar..
4-6% you'll be start forgetting where you are and turn into a blithering severely dehydrated idiot.
And about 8% you'll wake up Dead ;)

You can train motor units to fire till your hearts content but your brain will effectively shut them down to sustain itself..

'Oh - but I don't feel thirsty' you say ? Because your brain is more clever than yourself lol it can make you hungry to absorb water from the food.
Who's heard of the saying, if you feel hungry drink some water first ??
You can set yourself up for dehydration in the days prior to any exercise - a few beers wine coffee the list goes on of food that will make you loose water... Or consecutive days training without topping up your electrolyte levels.
So on the big day - you can be border line hydrated etc

With fluid loss, comes electrolyte loss as the body automatically flushes its levels to maintain a balance in your system... You may know of the story behind Gatorade or seen marathon runners hooked up to a drip - because it wasn't just water they lost. Ahaa now we're onto it :)

The picture pretty much tells its own story about who in the "food chain" is in charge !

To maximize your endurance performance make sure you are well hydrated "before" goin out - what I do is buy some electrolyte powder and mix it up and drink a few glasses the night before, then take some to drink - making sure I have little breaks and take a banana or two for the energy hit.

Also remember to add in a good stretch or flexibility routine daily...
The old broom stick twists are a great for trunk rotation flexibility in kiteing.

Remember - you are only as young as your spine is Supple :)
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kassak
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Re: Fitness and conditioning for kiting?

Postby kassak » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:30 am

Open water swimming it will do wonders for your mind and body!

I swim about 2 miles at a time for a total of 8-10 miles in the ocean each week in the season. It is an amazing experience and exercise. In any place with water you can usually find a group of like minded folks to swim with which is helpful for pushing yourself and for safety.

I think more than any other water sport/activity, other than birth, it connects you in a primal way to the sea...

Plus it makes crashing your kite a 1/2 mile offshore and being unable to relaunch seem like a couple of laps in the pool. The level of comfort it can build in the water is obviously limitless


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