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Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

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deniska
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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby deniska » Fri Sep 09, 2016 4:03 am

The thing is made out of hollow plastic (per some expo videos).
What are the chances of it breaking up into 2 parts during a jump?
It happened to me (and not only me) with the old CORE plastic bar before the titanium reinforcement was introduced..

Can you operate it with 5mm mittens? (Love the new Soul Suit :-) )

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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby Kamikuza » Fri Sep 09, 2016 6:13 am

deniska wrote:The thing is made out of hollow plastic (per some expo videos).
What are the chances of it breaking up into 2 parts during a jump?
It happened to me (and not only me) with the old CORE plastic bar before the titanium reinforcement was introduced..

Can you operate it with 5mm mittens? (Love the new Soul Suit :-) )
"at least as strong as a regular bar" but they really need me on the payroll to test gear to destruction....

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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby iriejohn » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:04 am

Starsky wrote:
iriejohn wrote:I have a twin tip and never "unhook"
Sorry I can't relate.

P.S. you don't need the quotes.
OK, I'll do it again.
Starsky wrote:A) There is nothing really wrong with the chicken loop and hook system. As long as I own a twin tip, I'll have one.
I have a twin tip, why do I need a chicken loop and hook system?

(PS the quotes were there because I have no CL or hook. hth)

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Starsky
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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby Starsky » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:33 am

I was just being sarcastic. I have shown my non hook and loop set up on here multiple times. I use it almost every session, but as long as I have a twin tip in the quiver I'll keep a hook and loop set up for it because unhooking is fun. I just think this sport if strange. People can spend a grand on a full carbon twin tip and wax on about how it makes them the emperor, but if they can't or won't unhook...... pfffft. That's not saying the average joe needs to unhook. It's just that the real rockstars of the sport do, and they do it mid 30 foot kite loop. I don't see any of those guys on full carbon boards. Funny.

Sounds like you have your set up figured out for what you do. Maybe this bar isn't for you. Maybe it suits someone else. I'm all for commercial non chicken loop systems. This or the north bar is not that. Bag on em for over engineering, bang on em for price, but don't bang on it for not being something it makes no attempt at being. It's misguided. You want to bang on a product for a fail in the redesign of the hook and loop system, have a look at the fireball.

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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby iriejohn » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:03 pm

Starsky wrote:I was just being sarcastic. I have shown my non hook and loop set up on here multiple times. I use it almost every session, but as long as I have a twin tip in the quiver I'll keep a hook and loop set up for it because unhooking is fun. I just think this sport if strange. People can spend a grand on a full carbon twin tip and wax on about how it makes them the emperor, but if they can't or won't unhook...... pfffft. That's not saying the average joe needs to unhook. It's just that the real rockstars of the sport do, and they do it mid 30 foot kite loop. I don't see any of those guys on full carbon boards. Funny.

Sounds like you have your set up figured out for what you do. Maybe this bar isn't for you. Maybe it suits someone else. I'm all for commercial non chicken loop systems. This or the north bar is not that. Bag on em for over engineering, bang on em for price, but don't bang on it for not being something it makes no attempt at being. It's misguided. You want to bang on a product for a fail in the redesign of the hook and loop system, have a look at the fireball.
I'm British/Canuck and in the future I'll remember that you, unlike most north Americans, understand that sarcasm is a finer form of wit. ;-)

As it happens I think that the OR bar is a much better execution of rear line trimming than North's Click bar (which I've today played with hands on). What I argue with is the industry's fixation with hooks and CL's - what is the problem with having modular connection systems?
Last edited by iriejohn on Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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sabraxas
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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby sabraxas » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:26 pm

I watched the surfexpo video, a woman trimming the new OR bar.

I see a future of newbies unwittingly kitelooping.

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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby windybrit » Fri Sep 09, 2016 2:30 pm

I'd wondered about that too, I rather suspect that since it's a click system then it'll be something you get used to very quickly, I'd imagine newbies would be taught not to look but just do it by feel. (like Index versus Friction shifting on a bicycle - showing my age here -. The concept looks really interesting, I am most interested to try.
sabraxas wrote:I watched the surfexpo video, a woman trimming the new OR bar.

I see a future of newbies unwittingly kitelooping.

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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby faklord » Fri Sep 09, 2016 2:58 pm

What does the PU centre line run through in the bar?
Ally, stainless, low friction plastic?
Is the insert replaceable?

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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby ORSales » Fri Sep 09, 2016 6:42 pm

Do-it wrote:
ORSales wrote:Alamos,
I'd love to get you, Argh and Starsky on the early bird demo list if interested... let's get your thoughts once you've used the bar!
Wtf am I....real bacon?
Ha ha ha ha ha ha - solid Canadian back bacon Do-it. I assumed we had you on the early bird list already. I have added you now...
sabraxas wrote:A few questions, OR sales:
¿What is the real purpose to replace the clamcleat with this trimming system?
¿What is the real advantage of this system vs clamcleat?
¿How quickly can you depower the bigger kites with this system?

Its seems to me a little bit weird to power/depower the kite in one far end of the bar, instead in the center part of it.

I would like to test the Stick Shift Bar.
Sabraxas - This system may not be for everyone and as such, we will always keep a version of our current Control Bar in the line up. However, to address your questions we feel this system offers a number of very specific benefits. In no particular order they are:

- Front lines carry more load. This makes trim adjustment harder and forces you to cleat and uncleat a trim line which is under a lot of load. This adds wear and tear to the cleat line and it means that if you slip, the bar goes to full power
- Back lines carry much less load - this means that it is much easier to adjust their settings, even when under full sail and without changing your course. Also, the spool winder is held in place with a retaining pin. When you bump the winder, it moves off the pin and lets the winder unspool. This means the trim line itself is never abused by a cleat.
- This winder is now always within reach and is very easy to turn, about as hard as turning a doorknob. Traditional front line trim systems above the bar are often out of reach, especially for shorter armed riders. Longer arms can reach the trim but then, of course, they also get frustrated by the lack of sheeting range their arms would otherwise have afforded them.
- This system lets you set the sliding stopper ball anywhere you want with no concern of front line trim interfering. This gives you massive sheeting range if you want it or less if you don't
- The front line re-ride safety systems that are standard on all bars these days often are complicated by potential tangles or snags with the front line trim adjustment. By removing this from the front lines, we help ensure a safe eject every time
- The winder mechanism advances in 1/4 rotational turns. This gives you 2cm of traditional trim adjustment per 1/4 rotation. This results in the ability to micro tune your kites power while under full sail. Not sure if you mountain bike but a few years ago someone came up with an automatic seat height adjustor. A button on your bar would raise or lower your seat post. I laughed... who would ever use that!?!? Ha ha ha ha. Then I went for a 2 hour ride with one and used it like 100 times. Once you have the ability to micro adjust as you're riding, you never go back.
foilholio wrote:I like the look of this bar a lot. It looks cleaner for some reason than the north one. Yet to be seen which works better and is more reliable. I do prefer a nice round bar and not something interrupting it like this U. I think having used auto unspin and bearings a lot on my flysurfers the square depower auto unspin on the north is going to create annoyances and issues, so I prefer this bar for avoiding that. The knob on this bar does look a bit big and I would prefer the north bar end maybe. If the knob was smaller I would have less issue with it.

These things are going to take many years to iron out all issues and find a market, if they do :-/.
Foliholio - thanks for the kind words. This has been a loong road for us. To address your comments...

- North has done an awesome job with their bar but we feel we have as well. We are very proud of the design choices we made and how simple we kept our design, there is one moving part that can be replaced in <10min if it breaks, which it won't.
- The nob size, we played with that a lot. It is basically as big as it needs to be to give you nice purchase without being massive. Big thing for us is that it lets you keep your hands on the bar when overpowered and depowering the kite, no hunting around the side for a recessed button.
- Our bar is also very simple to disassemble. I will get a video up shortly but it is 1 set screw to remove the winder assembly. This assembly can then be quickly reversed to put the winder on the port / left side of the bar and it takes about 10 min or so to swap out the trim line. Much fewer screws and parts...
- U bar shape - you'll need to hold it to appreciate this but a) it is incredibly light, much lighter than the aluminium bars and b) it feels exactly the same in your hand due to the eva foam wrap on it
- We toyed with the idea of an auto unspin and we may yet introduce one but the designs we were looking at all lead to the bar binding when in a kite loop, meaning you can't sheet the bar out under load and in a kite loop... our bar maintains sheeting ability even when fishing poled.

I agree tho, years of small details to iron out but we wanted to get this version to market and we are incredibly proud of it.

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ORSales
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Re: Ocean Rodeo stick shift bar

Postby ORSales » Fri Sep 09, 2016 7:36 pm

Kamikuza wrote:
deniska wrote:The thing is made out of hollow plastic (per some expo videos).
What are the chances of it breaking up into 2 parts during a jump?
It happened to me (and not only me) with the old CORE plastic bar before the titanium reinforcement was introduced..

Can you operate it with 5mm mittens? (Love the new Soul Suit :-) )
"at least as strong as a regular bar" but they really need me on the payroll to test gear to destruction....
Kamikuzza nailed it. We worked with Camosun College here in Victoria for 2+ years stress testing this bar. We tested with straight breaking forces, torsional forces, when the bar was heated and when it was frozen... it took a long time to get it right.

Yes, you can operate the bar with mittens on.

Can't speak to the Core bar. This bar is not plastic tho, it is a composite material that took us years of experimentation to get right. We did not sacrifice your safety in the interests of expediency.
windybrit wrote:I'd wondered about that too, I rather suspect that since it's a click system then it'll be something you get used to very quickly, I'd imagine newbies would be taught not to look but just do it by feel. (like Index versus Friction shifting on a bicycle - showing my age here -. The concept looks really interesting, I am most interested to try.
sabraxas wrote:I watched the surfexpo video, a woman trimming the new OR bar.

I see a future of newbies unwittingly kitelooping.
I can only speak about our bar. However, it relies on a simple 1/4 turn to adjust trim. When underpowered - and presumably in control - you take your hand off the bar to add power. When overpowered - and potentially nervous - you simply slide your hand down the bar to bump or nudge the knob and the bar depowers. This lets you remain focused on kite control and where you are going and not take your eye off the horizon (or hand off the bar) to look for and grab a trim line...
faklord wrote:What does the PU centre line run through in the bar?
Ally, stainless, low friction plastic?
Is the insert replaceable?
See pics below. The insert is held in place with 2x set screws and slides out easily if it wears down or if / when you wish to replace your trim line.
D3D07B24-D6EF-479E-A1D2-2A5B64C56019.JPG
IMG_2613.JPG


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