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Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

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justkite100
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Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby justkite100 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:14 am

Hi everyone.

This is my first post, I am new to kitesurfing and have some safety questions about the safety system on the F-One Bandit X (2017) with monolith bar.

I am a new kiter ( 10th time out yesterday) I took lessons and hired kit a few times and then got my own kit. I bought 9m and a 12m Bandit's.

I am happy with the kites but I have had some strange / bad experiences with the safety release system.
The system has a 'mini 5th line' ... when you release the chicken loop the leash line is connected to a swivel which then goes to the 2 front lines.

I have watched a few videos online which demo the safety system with the kite falling on to the water on to its canopy with the wing tips point up and the leading edge towards you with very little power left in the kite.... I never get this result when I use the system.

Every time I tested the system it does one of these things:
1.kite fell out of the sky on to the water: wing tips pointing away from me, leading edge down.
- I found it nearly impossible to re-connect the chicken loop as the leash line has so much pressure on it.

2. the kite landed on its side or on its leading edge wing tips towards me, downwind of me:
- This I find very difficult to recover the bar and re-connect the chicken loop as the kite still has a lot of power in in and I am dragged down-wind... I also find that when I pull the leash line it is rock solid and not much line seems to slip through the bar.

3. the kite had dropped on to it's trailing edge, leading edge pointing up:
- From this point it has some how re-laucnhed on its own but it ends up flying from the leash line with the control bar out of reach, or;
- relaunched and gone it to an uncontrollable spin/looping with only the leash line attached

Yesterday I used the system again and it did the looping out of control option which resulted in me losing my board and a massive tangle of lines.

I learnt on kites which 'flagged out' to a single line resulting in a total depower, I think I prefer this and am very close to losing all trust in the F-One safety system.

I would really appreciate any advice about the setup or my technique...or just any feedback.
Steve
Last edited by justkite100 on Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

Gobigorfoil
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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ???

Postby Gobigorfoil » Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:19 am

Hey,

That is exactly the reason I sold my 2016 bandit kites, great kite but a poorly designed quick release that doesn't release the power..

justkite100
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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ???

Postby justkite100 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:57 am

Yesterday it was flying in uncontrolled loops from the leash line dragging me very quickly. It was only by luck i got it under control but by that time I lost my board :(

I don't want to let this put me off kitesurfing but I do want to figure out whats going on with it as my confidence in the safety system has gone.
Is this a well known issue with F-One bandits?
Am I doing something wrong ?
Is the setup correct? (with the leash line to swivel then to the two front lines)
Do I need to check anything on the bar / lines ?

justkite100
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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ???

Postby justkite100 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:58 am

Gobigorfoil wrote:Hey,

That is exactly the reason I sold my 2016 bandit kites, great kite but a poorly designed quick release that doesn't release the power..
Hi... which kites did you buy instead?

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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby tmcfarla » Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:07 pm

I believe you can fly the Bandit on a regular, single-line flag-out bar. Meaning, you can replace just the bar instead of the whole kites. The safety system on them is outdated, but they are really nice kites.

Final note, my Bandit has usually behaved pretty well on two-front lines, so maybe take a picture of how you are connecting it so we can see if it looks right.

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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby alexeyga » Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:56 pm

That dysfunctional safety is one of the reasons why I've turned my back on Bandits. Well that and the simple fact that F-One has been selling us same gear in different colors since 2013. No innovation or improvements what so ever.

As far as safety goes - generally speaking - it seems to work better on smaller sizes and is next to useless on larger ones (12m+). Your millage may vary a lot depending on your weight (heavier = better), but it is always a case of a Russian roulette none the less.

Also, had to go through some warranty claims which were handled very poorly by our Canadian distributor and I was never able to speak with or hear from anybody alive at F-One's head office, even in their mother's tongue language.

Having had better experience with other brands/suppliers - at today's gear prices - it's really worth exploring other options. Bandit is a great kite, but it isn't the only great kite out there.

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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby jeromeL » Mon Jan 30, 2017 4:08 pm

I have had similar issues with bandit 7 and 8 edition, It's a known issue... You can always flag the kite by pulling one of the center line once you pull all the leash with bar at stopper ball, though don't mess with lines if wind is strong and make sure you don't get tangled in lines...

I have asked F-one directly with supporting videos and their answer was that bandit is a performance based kite and flagging kills 70% of power (don't remember exact number but it's not 100%) and if I want a safer kite I can take the fone Trust....
I have a feeling they do that because their bridle is really long so if kite is in true flag position, as you reset the bar and kite rotate the wingtip can catch the bridle which will start uncontrolled loop (deathloop), happened to me 3 times...

for 3) you can give a few tug on leash line and it will go to 1) or 2) ;)

I have had a few success true flag by pulling hard on leash line on 9m but 12m never had success, if you wait long enough and pull hard sometimes it flag. but even once it flag the kite can still turn around and somehow end up in the bad positions...

What I do usually I pull leash all the way pushing bar all the way to stopper ball, if there isn't too much power I grab with one hand chickenloop+ leashline and try to reset it. If it still has a bit of power I grab one of the center line so the kite goes in true flag position while I reset bar...

I still have fone bandit and use them occasionally but should probably use another bar with it, I haven't tried but I guess something like a cabrinha bar should work...

Kite is great, the bar safety is not so good and a pain to reset. Perfect bar would be same bar with single line safety and a swivel to unwind bar after loop.

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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby justkite100 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:42 pm

alexeyga wrote:That dysfunctional safety is one of the reasons why I've turned my back on Bandits. Well that and the simple fact that F-One has been selling us same gear in different colors since 2013. No innovation or improvements what so ever.

As far as safety goes - generally speaking - it seems to work better on smaller sizes and is next to useless on larger ones (12m+). Your millage may vary a lot depending on your weight (heavier = better), but it is always a case of a Russian roulette none the less.

Also, had to go through some warranty claims which were handled very poorly by our Canadian distributor and I was never able to speak with or hear from anybody alive at F-One's head office, even in their mother's tongue language.

Having had better experience with other brands/suppliers - at today's gear prices - it's really worth exploring other options. Bandit is a great kite, but it isn't the only great kite out there.
Hi Alexeyga.... which kites did you switch to?

justkite100
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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby justkite100 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:52 pm

jeromeL wrote:I have had similar issues with bandit 7 and 8 edition, It's a known issue... You can always flag the kite by pulling one of the center line once you pull all the leash with bar at stopper ball, though don't mess with lines if wind is strong and make sure you don't get tangled in lines...

I have asked F-one directly with supporting videos and their answer was that bandit is a performance based kite and flagging kills 70% of power (don't remember exact number but it's not 100%) and if I want a safer kite I can take the fone Trust....
I have a feeling they do that because their bridle is really long so if kite is in true flag position, as you reset the bar and kite rotate the wingtip can catch the bridle which will start uncontrolled loop (deathloop), happened to me 3 times...

for 3) you can give a few tug on leash line and it will go to 1) or 2) ;)

I have had a few success true flag by pulling hard on leash line on 9m but 12m never had success, if you wait long enough and pull hard sometimes it flag. but even once it flag the kite can still turn around and somehow end up in the bad positions...

What I do usually I pull leash all the way pushing bar all the way to stopper ball, if there isn't too much power I grab with one hand chickenloop+ leashline and try to reset it. If it still has a bit of power I grab one of the center line so the kite goes in true flag position while I reset bar...

I still have fone bandit and use them occasionally but should probably use another bar with it, I haven't tried but I guess something like a cabrinha bar should work...

Kite is great, the bar safety is not so good and a pain to reset. Perfect bar would be same bar with single line safety and a swivel to unwind bar after loop.
Hi JeromeL, thanks for your reply... it sounds like you have had very similar issues.
When I bought the kites I just stood in the water and practiced using the safety system. One thing I noticed compared to the single line flag out kites I learnt on was how do I properly pack down the kite?
On a single line flag out it is the wrap the harness leash around the bar procedure, however this doesn't seem to work on the bandit-x / monolith bar. When I tried practicing this the kite actually started flying with the leash line wrapped around the bar.

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Re: Safety System. F-One Bandit X 2017 ?

Postby alexeyga » Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:09 pm

justkite100 wrote:
Hi Alexeyga.... which kites did you switch to?
Provided that you're just a beginner - I suppose you're looking for a solid and easy all-rounder. As such, just about any mainstream kite will do just fine. Core XR4, Airush Lithium, North Evo, Liquid Force Envy, Cabrinha SwitchBlade (heavier bar pressure). All depends where you're shopping.

You could also simply get a different bar - Core's for example (must be Sensor2 or newer) or North's would be a good match.

Personally I'm on a mixed quiver or Airush and Zeeko kites all of which I'm flying of the Airush bar (single-line flagging).


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