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Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a ram air lover

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alexrider
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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby alexrider » Thu Mar 30, 2017 10:17 pm

I appreciate your comment... up to a point, Peter. It seems we don't have the same understanding of "kick". The topic you brought perhaps deserves a separate thread in itself.
Have you never been in the humiliating situation, with a big foil kite in marginal wind conditions (especially if there is current flowing in the same direction) that you cannot manage to engage the kite in a loop, when many (latest generation) LEIs around can? Some FS models were more prone to that than others, and amongst the recent ones, the Sonic FR markedly more than Sonic2. Please do not suspect a lack of experience with foil kites on my part; after 14 years, I believe I can fly them to their optimum.
IMO, as long as you can just about fly an LEI, you can loop it. It's not the case with foils.
To get more oomph to get going, I now paradoxically take a smaller, faster (and lighter!) kite when it's fart wind. For the same reason, I believe I'd pick a 15 Ultra over a foil. Not to mention the fun element which we agree upon. :jump:
There is a reason the freestyle hotdoggers all prefer LEI for their tricks. It was even difficult to get the pope of airstyle Toby to convert to foils. Maybe he'll find some ass kicking joy with the Sonic2 he just got ?
Peter_Frank wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2017 7:14 am
alexrider wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2017 2:35 pm
Snip....
Paradoxically, for hydrofoiling, I'd rather get an Ultra instead of a foilkite for the lightest conditions, because it gives you the kiteloop kick in the butt you need to get in the air.
Snip....
Actually not true, the LEI kites turns way better than the "slow dog" foil kites yes, but the race foil kites still gives you more kick when looped thus you can start earlier on these, no doubt :thumb:

Having said that, I prefer a light LEI any time, over the peak power racefoil kites (got both), because they are so much more fun in every way - and IF it goes down, no problem as you can just take it easy and either wait for a puff to relaunch, or drift comfortably ashore for a relaunch.
So much more fun, and no worries.

I was fortunate to try a 6 m2 Ultra in January (hydrofoiling), a really pleasant kite, turned well, drifted well, good power on demand and can spill power too, no flapping - a really nice encounter and definitely a choice many has been waiting for - a way more refined kite than the (older) Airush One that also was loved a lot amongst the early hydrofoilers :D

8) Peter

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby Peter_Frank » Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:11 am

Yes, I think it should have its own thread.

These light LEI kites can hang quite easy in less wind than you can ride, thats for sure and the whole idea - awesome to be able to get ashore when the wind drops, without dropping the kite, you can just fly or loop the kite thus drag yourself and your board to shore (in the water).

But in the same wind, too low for foiling when looping but able to keep your LEI flying, I would postulate that you can definitely loop many race foilkites and get going even earlier simply because they are way more efficient and has a lot longer and more extreme powerstroke spike which is essential.

When standing on the beach you can fly and loop a foilkite in 1-2 knots of wind, right? Easy (eventhough difficult to start - you have to run it up).
So on the water in say 4-6 knots of wind, even when no solid ground, why would you not be able to loop the foil kites?
Sometimes the only way to keep them flying.
No, have never experienced not being able to loop a foil kite in marginal wind - but have often seen, and tried myself, not being able to get up foiling with a light LEI kite that can just hang, eventhough super easy to loop yes.

Assume we are talking lines in the 30 m neighbourghood for both types of kites - otherwise it is not marginal wind :wink:

I also prefer using a tad smaller kite for the most marginal winds, as it accelerates even faster and turns well, so the same powerspike (maybe even more?) than a bigger kite IMO, goes for both types of kites :naughty:

Having said that, I can easily drop my foil kite in this wind, if I make a mistake, yes, but thats my own fault and not because it can not be looped.
For this and many other reasons I prefer light LEIs as soon as possible to ride these, but need the race foil kite for pushing the low end to its most marginal limit :thumb:

8) Peter

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby Peter_Frank » Sat Apr 01, 2017 6:36 pm

The wonderful thing about for these kites like the Airush Ultra, is their abilitiy to hang in such low wind, just as good actually often better than race foil kites.

And really often, the wind is dead onshore when marginal (below 7 knots), thus you can not really ride with a race foil kite as it does not hang as easy...

If the wind is a bit from the side, you can loop the foil kite and get yourself dragged out and free from the ground - and then they definitely can start and ride earlier than the light LEI kites.
BUT, if you make just one small error, they go down and you are in for a really troublesome swim.
Easier to save a light LEI here, so the advantage in marginal low end is at a cost.

And when dead onshore, you can not loop the foilkite if using a normal mast, as you will get dragged into too low water - this does not happen with the light LEIs as they can be looped much tighter (but also less power), so you can get up on the board and might have a chance to get out "free", where you can loop till you can ride.

Meaning, in dead onshore the LEI is just as good for getting out.
When wind from the side, you can lower the marginal limit a bit with a high AR foil kite, but you will very often end up doing a pack down and a swim to shore.

The LEI can hang in just as low wind, but not start in the same - meaning you will most often avoid a swim with these, and even if, you dont have to pack everything down and dry for a long time till you can ride again.

The short thing I am saying is: I almost never use my race foil kites anymore :naughty:

On a sidenote: Having one strut gives you some advantages over no strut kites, easier to handle and reverse up in a yiffy, they dont get as wet when on the water, nor as much sand when on the beach after a swim/drift to shore (even better with more struts but heavier), but both have their advantages.

Looking forward to the Ultra :thumb:

8) Peter

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby Peert » Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:45 am

PeterP wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:17 am
Info on Airush Ultra here: http://airush.com/2017/kites/ultra/

ULTRA 5m = 1.7kg
ULTRA 6m = 1.8kg
ULTRA 7m = 2.11kg
ULTRA 8m = 2.19kg
ULTRA 9m = 2.28kg
ULTRA 12m = 2.6kg
ULTRA 15m = 3.4kg
I have put a 2007 14m Best Waroo on the scale:
3.65kg
I removed two struts now it is 3.15kg did not try it yet but I know it will work fine as it also flew well with those struts deflated...

If you relate this to the ULTRA weights it does not seem overly ultra ;-)

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby zloilyoha » Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:14 am

Peert wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:45 am


I have put a 2007 14m Best Waroo on the scale:
3.65kg
I removed two struts now it is 3.15kg did not try it yet but I know it will work fine as it also flew well with those struts deflated...

If you relate this to the ULTRA weights it does not seem overly ultra ;-)
ha ha :D

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby ShaveTheWhales » Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:24 am

I understand the light weight enthusiasm but i think a valuable point is being missed here..

I cannot count the number of times ive been out light wind kiting and seen kites and some foils fall out of the sky - while mine stays happily in the air !

Sure make a kite and bang a strut or struts into the leading edge, but thats not gonna help it stay in the air..

Its the design efficiency exact same principle as these two aircraft... will the new light and awesome one stay in the sky at a very low air speed ?

Yes the Heavy Hercules wins - funny that huh..
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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby windmaker » Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:00 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 6:36 pm
The wonderful thing about for these kites like the Airush Ultra, is their abilitiy to hang in such low wind, just as good actually often better than race foil kites.

8) Peter
?? Not sure about the Airush ultra, but I own both F-One Breeze 11m (one strut) and F-One diablo 10m (foil) and there is no comparison. The Diablo can hang in much less wind than the Breeze. In fact for me it's the only reason for owning a foil kite .

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby abel » Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:29 pm

windmaker wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:00 pm
Peter_Frank wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 6:36 pm
The wonderful thing about for these kites like the Airush Ultra, is their abilitiy to hang in such low wind, just as good actually often better than race foil kites.

8) Peter
?? Not sure about the Airush ultra, but I own both F-One Breeze 11m (one strut) and F-One diablo 10m (foil) and there is no comparison. The Diablo can hang in much less wind than the Breeze. In fact for me it's the only reason for owning a foil kite .
Somehow, I found that the Breeze doesn't like to hang out as I would expect, especially at the window edges.
The heavier Solo V2 hangs out better because of the aerodynamic structure. The gruntiness keeps it hanging despite the weight.
When gliding, it's a different story.

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby gbrungra » Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:07 pm

Peert wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:45 am
PeterP wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:17 am
Info on Airush Ultra here: http://airush.com/2017/kites/ultra/

ULTRA 5m = 1.7kg
ULTRA 6m = 1.8kg
ULTRA 7m = 2.11kg
ULTRA 8m = 2.19kg
ULTRA 9m = 2.28kg
ULTRA 12m = 2.6kg
ULTRA 15m = 3.4kg
I have put a 2007 14m Best Waroo on the scale:
3.65kg
I removed two struts now it is 3.15kg did not try it yet but I know it will work fine as it also flew well with those struts deflated...

If you relate this to the ULTRA weights it does not seem overly ultra ;-)
I have three 2007 waroo best kites. Maybe I should repurpose them as light wind kites?!?

I was just going to sell them on eBay for $100 each...

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Re: Airush Ultra: one strut kite that meets expectations of a foilkite fan

Postby Peert » Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:56 pm

gbrungra wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:07 pm
Peert wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:45 am
PeterP wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:17 am
Info on Airush Ultra here: http://airush.com/2017/kites/ultra/

ULTRA 5m = 1.7kg
ULTRA 6m = 1.8kg
ULTRA 7m = 2.11kg
ULTRA 8m = 2.19kg
ULTRA 9m = 2.28kg
ULTRA 12m = 2.6kg
ULTRA 15m = 3.4kg
I have put a 2007 14m Best Waroo on the scale:
3.65kg
I removed two struts now it is 3.15kg did not try it yet but I know it will work fine as it also flew well with those struts deflated...

If you relate this to the ULTRA weights it does not seem overly ultra ;-)
I have three 2007 waroo best kites. Maybe I should repurpose them as light wind kites?!?

I was just going to sell them on eBay for $100 each...
I hope I will find some time and wind to get to the water. Will report back to you how well this works..
Can and will compare it to my Naish Trip strutless.


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