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Best control bar

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Windigo1
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Re: Best control bar

Postby Windigo1 » Wed Jul 12, 2017 6:45 pm

From 2016 onwards pretty much all the companies have adopted the same configuration with a cleat for depower a below the bar swivel and single front line flagging. There's few exceptions Core with their weird twist and F-One who insist in living in the past with no swivel and a mini fifth line that results deathloops 50% of the time that you activate your safety.

Besides those they are very similar. I would get the one that matches your kites it will be easier to sell them down the road.

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edt
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Re: Best control bar

Postby edt » Wed Jul 12, 2017 8:07 pm

one more thing. if you get a used bar good thing to buy some new lines too, i wouldn't trust used lines so that's another $100-$200 for the lines. That's why getting last year's model still new is such a good deal. If you are picking up a used control bar for $200 and then add another $100-$200 for a new set of lines then you're not really saving money over new but last year's control bar.

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Re: Best control bar

Postby knot_moving » Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:11 am

edt wrote:
Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:12 pm
starsky's response is spot on. As for the various brands, Cabrinha is well known for being finicky and hard to put back together in the water also they tend to change designs each year so they tend to make it more complicated than it needs to be.

my feelings on the various brands
...
liquid force: I like what they have done with their new bar, it is really nice but again, it has been getting more expensive. How do they make these nice bars so expensive? Make sure it is 2016 or later, as the earlier models are kind of garbage, and anything earlier than 2010 is actually dangerous.
Real had new LF 2016 bars for $200 back in May - bought one and reasonably happy with it

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Re: Best control bar

Postby Faxie » Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:33 am

edt wrote:
Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:12 pm
starsky's response is spot on. As for the various brands, Cabrinha is well known for being finicky and hard to put back together in the water also they tend to change designs each year so they tend to make it more complicated than it needs to be.

my feelings on the various brands

north: the gold standard. You want to make sure you get one that is 2016 or later as earlier bars don't support 4 line kites properly (they had a "mini-5th"). So expensive!! I never use north bars because of the expense but it's my favorite.

liquid force: I like what they have done with their new bar, it is really nice but again, it has been getting more expensive. How do they make these nice bars so expensive? Make sure it is 2016 or later, as the earlier models are kind of garbage, and anything earlier than 2010 is actually dangerous.

Naish: My go to bar when I'm shopping for a used control bar. You can get last year's model easy for under $250. Now that's a lot of bang for your buck!

Slingshot: Very nice control bars.

Switch: Garbage. I wouldn't bother with this online vendor until they figure it out. Give them a few more years before they make a decent bar. They have problems figuring out how to make a decent swivel that always releases the holes they drilled out in early models specifically were a size that could get your lines snagged not good.

cabrinha: Overly complicated. But they work fine if you get a recent enough year. Very old Cabrinha's (more than 5 years old) will again be "mini-5th" so make sure it's a fairly recent. Way to fiddly for my taste.

Core: I would never buy a core bar. They have this "twisty" release which is different from all other bars. Come on Core get with the program make it "push away".

Ozone: great control bar. Also getting expensive. I don't believe they use a swivel which is fine by me.

I remember demoing a best bar recently but can't remember my impressions of it.

There's others out there I can't remember, those are just the ones I can think off of the top of my head which I've tried out.
Problem with the Switch bar wasn't the swivel at first, but the thread to secure the linesplices was changed at some point, making the splices a tiny bit thicker and having to need more force to get pulled through the swivel. They updated the swivel (no idea why they just didn't go back to the old splices) and everyone that had problems could get a replacement.

Other than that it's a very decent bar, although ugly. Ironic you're calling North the golden standard, but the Switch is basically an improved version of the 2012 North bar. (imo the 2013+ Norths are too fragile, floats and caps area) And Switch is one of the few brands (maybe only one? Not sure at the moment) that uses a splice/pigtail combination in stead of sleeves. Way stronger in the long run. And it costs half.

There's a V4 on the way very soon. Takes care of all the things most people complained about over the years. (PU, softer grip, no swivel above, integrated floats)

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Re: Best control bar

Postby foilonfoil » Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:49 am

edt wrote:
Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:12 pm
Ozone: great control bar. Also getting expensive. I don't believe they use a swivel which is fine by me.
The Ozone Race bar is very popular in the foiling community with lots of adjustments and customization options. The swivel is below the bar and built into the release mechanism. The cleats wear out but are easy to replace - Have a few spare as once they start slipping they are useless. What I like about the the Ozone bar is the reliable front line/stopper ball/flag system... It just works and the bar can work with thicker 3rd party lines if needed (Q-Power) without flag issues.

I will be receiving an OR Stick Shift bar this week - It looks impressive and I have been told by OR that it can also accept 3rd party lines (Q-Powerline). I am considering it as a my next "go to" bar to replace my Ozone bars.

- Cabrinha bars up until 2017 suck. I had problems resetting after flagging, and wear issues. The 2012 bar double sucks due to its flag system and hi-v configuration.
- I don't like the Core twist release.
- F-One will have a swivel on their new 2018 bar releasing shortly.
- I have no experience with North.
- Switch bar is junk.
- Flysurfer bar is nice but not as easy to customize to my personal tastes due to double hole in the bar and very small hole in the release which does not work well with 3rd party lines.
- Slingshot are heavy but built tough. I was not a fan of the below the bar depower, although there is an option for above the bar depower now.

An optimal bar for me has:
- Long (adjustable) throw
- Low V lines
- 4 line equal line length
- Single line flag.
- Ability to accept thicker lines.
- 52-55cm

My preference:
1. OR Stick Shift pending review/experience... Could be awful ;)
2. Ozone Race
3. Slingshot.
4. Custom... Camet in San Deigo is building Carbon Fiber race bars but not appropriate for beginners.

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Re: Best control bar

Postby rjkritzer » Thu Jul 13, 2017 9:49 pm

I use, and like, the Cabrinha 2017 Recoil bar with the Fireball connection. My main reason for buying was that my arms seem a bit short when kitesurfing. With other bars, I always felt like I was stretching to be sheeted out. The Recoil/fireball keeps everything a little closer to the body. However, the Recoil bar is comparatively busy with 2 bungees for power and depower. Winding the lines takes a little getting used to.

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cglazier
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Re: Best control bar

Postby cglazier » Fri Jul 14, 2017 3:12 am

My opinion.

Cabrinha bars are clunky and gimicky (which is why they had to keep changing them every year)
North are good but be aware they come with a high Y line setup which is not appropriate for other brand kites (also not good for relaunching or self landing 4 line kites)
Naish is good
Ozone is good

I don't have enough experience on others to comment. But what you should look for is:
-simple push away quick release (that can be easily reloaded on the water!)
-flagging to one front line after you deploy the quick release
-low Y line connection (both front lines are within reach)
-simple depower trim adjustment (usually a jam cleat)
-typically 50 cm width for 7 to 12m kites

Many older bars do not have these simple features.

:wink: CG

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Re: Best control bar

Postby alford » Fri Jul 14, 2017 3:59 am

@foilonfoil, isn't the issue with thicker lines the fact knots or splices won't flow through the QR?
If the problem is at the top swivel or the front line splitter it's an easy fix, just replace with the Ozone splitter and ball. Would you really replace that nice Liros line on the Stick Shift bar with Q Power? Not a hater, just asking.

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Re: Best control bar

Postby Onda » Fri Jul 14, 2017 9:05 am

I´ve had quite a few bars.
My actual favourite is the 2016 Cabrinha Trimlite Bar. I always avoided Cab bards due to the clunky and complex design. But the Trimlite is really reduced to the relevant functions, very light, very good quality of the lines, very good QR system (very easy to re-assemble) overall very pleasing. Plus very soft bar ends (important if you use a surfboard to avoid demages to the board).
You can purchase a new Trimlite Bar for less than EUR 250 in Germany :thumb:

The Slingshot bar have excellent lines (by far the best, IMHO), but the bar is very heavy and the bar ends easily demage your surfboard.

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Re: Best control bar

Postby foilonfoil » Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:08 pm

alford wrote:
Fri Jul 14, 2017 3:59 am
@foilonfoil, isn't the issue with thicker lines the fact knots or splices won't flow through the QR?
If the problem is at the top swivel or the front line splitter it's an easy fix, just replace with the Ozone splitter and ball. Would you really replace that nice Liros line on the Stick Shift bar with Q Power? Not a hater, just asking.
I did ask OR and they confirmed q-powerline would work fine. I do plan to take a serious look at the Liros line - It will be the first time seeing it for me.

Over 1400 Miles/2250 kilometers kiting over the last twelve months that were logged and a more unlogged. I do a bunch of offshore kiting where I can be up to 5 miles away from the beach. In 2015 I suffered three flying line line breaks on three different bars. On one break, the shock also blew out bridle lines on my foil kite. It's the failure mode of Q-Powerline that I like. Q line is two lines in one and when a break occurs, its likely the outer sheath which exposes the inner sheath but the line will still hold together. I have had two q lines "break" but it was a non event.
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