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Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

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ralu81
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Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby ralu81 » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:48 pm

I have a 2012 12m Cabrinha Vector that won't die so I'm going to keep it, but the lines on the 2012 Cabrinha bar have been stretched a lot since getting it and I have concerns how much longer they're going to last, so I'm going to buy a new bar. The old bar flags on both front lines and most bars are single line now and I prefer single line flagging. I tried the kite on a slingshot bar with single line flag out in about 18 knots and had no issues when I flagged it. I even let it flap for a few minutes so I could see if it would potentially go into death loop or something similar. Nothing happened, the kite flagged and behaved like it should. Is there something I'm missing? is there something else that could happen? Cabrinha put out a bar compatibility chart the year they switched to single line flag out and it said not to use the new bars with the old kites.

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edt
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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby edt » Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:15 pm

The only real way to know for sure is test it. If it tests ok then go with it! The compatibility charts are more like hints than must do. You are absolutely fine.

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abel
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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby abel » Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:19 pm

If the kite was thoroughly used, then the kite itself probably stretched and has deformations that new lines will not really fix.
Lines length stretching can be easily compensated with extension pigtails or knots on the connection points.
But, if the lines are old, this becomes a safety issue and I wouldn't recommend messing with old lines.

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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby whabbits » Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:27 pm

Someone correct me if I am wrong but I am 99% sure that any single front line flag out bar will safely eject a kite with a bridle that is designed to roll over when ejected on the front two lines.
Last edited by whabbits on Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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edt
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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby edt » Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:54 pm

whabbits wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:27 pm
Someone correct me if I am wrong but I am 99% sure that any single front line flag out bar will safely eject a kite with a bridle that is designed to roll over when ejected on the front two lines.

Todd

You said it in a weird way but yes. You can use a kite designed for the mini-5th on a single line flagging bar, 100% of the time (even tho the cabrinha chart says not to do it). The other way you have to test it, using a mini-5th (high Y system) control bar on a newer kite sometimes works, sometimes doesn't.

Anyway if you are worried test it and if it tests ok go for it!

ralu81
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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby ralu81 » Tue Jan 30, 2018 7:17 pm

Thanks for the replies... I did test and I didn't have any issues. Has anyone else tested it out and had different results?

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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby Hugh2 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:18 am

I dumped the IDS Cabrinha bar on my 2012 12m Cabrinha Vector and changed to a Best bar with single line flag out several years ago. No problems with dumping the kite to the leash on a beach when alone and overpowered.

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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby jeromeL » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:07 pm

whabbits wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:27 pm
Someone correct me if I am wrong but I am 99% sure that any single front line flag out bar will safely eject a kite with a bridle that is designed to roll over when ejected on the front two lines.
I think you are right except for some older kite design...

I thought on older kite design and bridle you could experience the kite rotating on itself (spiral of death) when flaggin on 1 line, that's one reason 2 line flagging was chosen for some kites, though every kite that came out after 2012 are probably ok on 1 line...

I guess it depends on bridle and shape of leading edge and strut. if there is limited change of AoA on that particular kite, and no pulley , i could imagine one line flaggin keeping shape of kite enough for it to do the spiral of death thingy...

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edt
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Re: Double Line Flagging Kite w/ Single Line Bar?

Postby edt » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:24 pm

for a true C kite if you run it in 4 line mode when you hit the QR, it will indeed spiral and turn your lines into spaghetti. Now the problem with this is that if you try to run a mini-5th on a C kite it will just keep flying, so your only options are 1) single line flagging and spaghetti or 2) true 5th line. If a kite can properly turn a U shape by using a mini-5th then it will perform fine with a single line, it won't spiral. Today the only kite that will spiral is the slingshot fuel run in 4 line mode all other true C kites are run in 5 line mode now. I mean, it's a pain making sphaghetti on the fuel, but the QR still works, it does depower it just makes a mess of the lines. Some of the older QR systems (pre 2008) would try to single line flag on rear line (instead of a center line). That will cause a kite to spiral no matter what kind it is. Some control bars still give you the option to flag out on a rear line as an emergency option. Anyway that's all history, all modern kites can flag to a single center line today.


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