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Downloop after kiteloop

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alex85
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Downloop after kiteloop

Postby alex85 » Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:01 pm

Hooked in, after a massive kiteloop I can't downloop and finish the entire downloop/second kiteloop before the landings every time,while I'm in the air (always start the downloop in the air but I finish the loop with the board already in the water) ...I thought it was only a question of height but sometimes I can do it also if the height is "under the average"...tight radius???larger radius???waiting too long before start to redirect the kite???or am I wrong and it's only a matter of height...what do you think?

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Slappysan
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Re: Downloop after kiteloop

Postby Slappysan » Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:02 am

It doesn't matter if you finish it in the air or on the water, the reason you need to downloop is to give the kite some apparent wind so it generates lift to soften your landing, the direction the kite is headed (still down or back up) doesn't matter, only that it starts to move and see apparent wind.

If you boost high enough or get updrafts you'll need to complete multiple loops to keep the kite from stalling and you falling too fast.

alex85
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Slingshot fuel 2015 13 meters
Naish torch 2015 10 meters
North Vegas 2015 7 meters
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Re: Downloop after kiteloop

Postby alex85 » Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:39 pm

Slappysan wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:02 am
It doesn't matter if you finish it in the air or on the water, the reason you need to downloop is to give the kite some apparent wind so it generates lift to soften your landing, the direction the kite is headed (still down or back up) doesn't matter, only that it starts to move and see apparent wind.

If you boost high enough or get updrafts you'll need to complete multiple loops to keep the kite from stalling and you falling too fast.
I know what you're meaning...and I must downloop or kiteloop after a "pussyloop" to soften my landings or those are impossible...what I'm trying to say is the step after, to be able to that while in the air and to undestand if the answer is just, I have to go bigger...

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jeromeL
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Re: Downloop after kiteloop

Postby jeromeL » Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:39 pm

alex85 wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:01 pm
Hooked in, after a massive kiteloop I can't downloop and finish the entire downloop/second kiteloop before the landings every time,while I'm in the air (always start the downloop in the air but I finish the loop with the board already in the water) ...I thought it was only a question of height but sometimes I can do it also if the height is "under the average"...tight radius???larger radius???waiting too long before start to redirect the kite???or am I wrong and it's only a matter of height...what do you think?
Lately on bigger kiteloop I have had issues of timing and position of the landing loop in window and after finishing second loop i would drop fast from 5 8 feet making it hard to land. other times kite catch me with tons of power.
issue is less apparent on small height kiteloop because you swing back under kite pretty close to water line so the tight timing makes things kind of work only 1 way. When you go higher there is a bit more freedom on position of kite and timing and you start to have a few issues when all variable don't line up.

I think explanation is position of kite as you start the second loop, also how compact your body and leg will impact tension in line so that's another variable..
it's hard to explain but after first loop your body will start to swing downwind or even a bit toward where you were coming from like a transition. depending on that and your stance as kite climb back to 12 you get a feel if you have to do a second kiteloop or downloop, but really you should rediect kite slightly back so as you go under kite you can downloop with a lot of tension of in the line for a very floaty landing loop. If kite is a bit too much to the right and you downloop kite there won't be as much tension and lift..

Actually I usually do the second loop quite wide. they loop super over head anyway so wider loop kind of retain power for longer time.

Finishing loop isn't as important as relative kite position when you initiate the landing loop. As soon as you sheet in for the second loop, if it's well positioned it will provide a lot of power very early and quite late into the loop.

Anyway after doing kiteloop for 1 to 1 and half years, I realized that on bigger one I can stall kite a bit and also send it a bit left or right of 12 as the kite catch me so I can do landing loop on other side of window.
So if you want to do a second kiteloop just redirect kite a bit forward as it catch you then crank bar for a second kiteloop, if you want to do a transition then send kite a bit back when it catch you and pull front hand for downloop. doing that it change a bit the direction your body travel under kite and increase tension in line when you do the landing loop...


Here is one of my latest kiteloop session. Still not exactly at megaloop level, wind were mostly under 25 knots so need a bit more.
You can see that some of the second loop i start with kite too much overhead instead of positioning it a bit to the side before swinging under kite, on those I drop fast last second and butt check landing... At that time I still wasn't super clear why in some case i do the second loop as a downloop or kiteloop but now looking back i realize why this is the case.
phpBB [video]


This is really stupid because I know how to do a proper ladning loop, (downloop or kiteloop) on normal jump, you have to steer kite one way or the other to control how your body swing under kite prior to doing them.
For kiteloop because i wasn't going so high I never really thought about the technique for landing loop, but technique is exactly same except that on kiteloop you already have your body going downwind.

Another thing to consider on big powerfull kiteloop: you will go very very fast under kite, I realized that on those it's actually better to keep bar quite sheeted in to stall kite a bit so kite doesn't climb back to fast, it gives you a bit more control to position it well, else you will shoot past your kite and it will fall out of sky even if you initiate it quite early...

a99
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Re: Downloop after kiteloop

Postby a99 » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:14 am

After a jump and kiteloop how is going with the second loop or heliloop - you looking up in milisecond to the kite position in sky ? I think not looking to the kite lot of kiters, because there is no time to look up after first kiteloop and you can look only in searching landing in water surface preparation, right ? So, heli or downloop you must do only in sensative way on the bar, right ? Even after a huge megaloop and falling down you have no time to look to kite for softer landing loop as you looking only back to water, right ?

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jeromeL
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Re: Downloop after kiteloop

Postby jeromeL » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:31 pm

a99 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:14 am
After a jump and kiteloop how is going with the second loop or heliloop - you looking up in milisecond to the kite position in sky ? I think not looking to the kite lot of kiters, because there is no time to look up after first kiteloop and you can look only in searching landing in water surface preparation, right ? So, heli or downloop you must do only in sensative way on the bar, right ? Even after a huge megaloop and falling down you have no time to look to kite for softer landing loop as you looking only back to water, right ?
When you finish loop you see kite going up to 12, it’s either a bit left or right, and I guess you feel it too. Also some kiter tug opposite side of bar just when kite catch them before doing heliloop.i think on video of Ross Dillion it’s pretty noticeable.
Though when you learn and our brain freeze so of course you can’t think about it. It’s kind of 50/50 guess based on feel. With experience you are more conscious of what you are doing. Also I noticed when going bigger and smaller kite you have a lot more control of where kite is catching you, so you can position more freely.
You don’t need to look up, when kite loop, it’s in front of you, as you swing under it you already know where it’s catching you, so it’s based on feel but at first ou look up and often miss landing.
I think on my video I rarely look up, though my video from 1 year ago I always look up when kite catch me...


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