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We need the whole kite communities help!

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Toby
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Toby » Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:43 pm

I am pretty sure they will accept any certificates.

sarc
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby sarc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:47 pm

Toby wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:32 am
The problem is that’s the only way to have something to show...how can you trust someone telling I can Kite and then f**** it all up...those people are out there.

Better to show a level 3 than not being able to Kite at all.

If you can Kite it is easy to get a level 3 card. Costs a bit, do it once, problem solved.

PS: not a fan of regulations too, but better than having no access.
Like, IKO certified people are all skilled and never make stupid mistakes? Hmmmmmmm.....

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Toby
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Toby » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:06 pm

sarc wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:47 pm
Toby wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:32 am
The problem is that’s the only way to have something to show...how can you trust someone telling I can Kite and then f**** it all up...those people are out there.

Better to show a level 3 than not being able to Kite at all.

If you can Kite it is easy to get a level 3 card. Costs a bit, do it once, problem solved.

PS: not a fan of regulations too, but better than having no access.
Like, IKO certified people are all skilled and never make stupid mistakes? Hmmmmmmm.....
we all know it's BS...but what is the alternative?

Matteo V
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Matteo V » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:57 pm

Ban = no kiting

IKO requirement = some kiting


Sometimes you have to make a deal with the devil in order to continue on. Stop the ban first, then squabble over the details of kiting. Never willingly let a ban go through or it will set precedent and we will ALL be stuck on ONE beach only accessible by boat.....until a single endangered bird poops on it........and then we will lose that.

Please support your sport.

I will sign.

Kitemanmuc
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Kitemanmuc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:04 pm

Toby wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:41 am
Already done!
Hope we can all help!

Question: is 75th street also in danger?
Thank you Toby. No 75th is safe. It is an official concession run to perfection by the guys from TKS Miami. The spot is however already overflowing with kiters and they cannot handle the hundreds more who would flock to their spot of the sport is ban across the rest of the beach.

Kitemanmuc
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Kitemanmuc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:08 pm

sarc wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:47 pm
Toby wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:32 am
The problem is that’s the only way to have something to show...how can you trust someone telling I can Kite and then f**** it all up...those people are out there.

Better to show a level 3 than not being able to Kite at all.

If you can Kite it is easy to get a level 3 card. Costs a bit, do it once, problem solved.

PS: not a fan of regulations too, but better than having no access.
Like, IKO certified people are all skilled and never make stupid mistakes? Hmmmmmmm.....
I understand the frustration and we don't like it either. We know that people with IKO 3 make mistakes as well, but Toby is spot on. Its that, or no kiting at all. We have gone to dozens of meetings with commissioners and non-kiting residents and this is one of the requests they are pushing for. There will be 1 designated spot in Miami Beach that will not require IKO 3 or similar certification as it stands at the moment. The other spots near the condos and hotels will require IKO 3. Its sort of a deal breaker. Its that or nothing.

Kitemanmuc
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Kitemanmuc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:09 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:57 pm
Ban = no kiting

IKO requirement = some kiting


Sometimes you have to make a deal with the devil in order to continue on. Stop the ban first, then squabble over the details of kiting. Never willingly let a ban go through or it will set precedent and we will ALL be stuck on ONE beach only accessible by boat.....until a single endangered bird poops on it........and then we will lose that.

Please support your sport.

I will sign.
Lol. Exactly!

Kitemanmuc
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Kitemanmuc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:12 pm

slowboat wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 12:55 pm
Toby wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 12:50 pm
if there is an alternative to IKO, or an additional certification, it's more than welcome.

That's what you say but that is not what the petition says. Therefore, don't sign it as written.

IF you have to have certification, accept alternatives: local schools, PASA, community based kiting organizations, etc, etc.
Sorry, we should write IKO 3 or equivalent. You are absolutely right. I hope you understand though that, its that or a ban. Its not really a negotiation at this point with the city and we have been working our butts off trying to salvage anything we can. The Miami Beach Neighborhood Association has agreed to support kiteboarding under one condition and that is if IKO 3 or equivalent is required. It is the only way. Ive changed the language in the petition and hope to receive your support. You can also see that we are petitioning for additional spots for beginners and novice kiters, who in that case would not be IKO 3 (or equivalent).

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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Bille » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:23 pm

*
Last edited by Bille on Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Kitemanmuc
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Re: We need the whole kite communities help!

Postby Kitemanmuc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:34 pm

Bille wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:23 pm
slowboat wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:49 am
Toby wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:32 am
The problem is that’s the only way to have something to show...how can you trust someone telling I can Kite and then f**** it all up...those people are out there.

Better to show a level 3 than not being able to Kite at all.

If you can Kite it is easy to get a level 3 card. Costs a bit, do it once, problem solved.

PS: not a fan of regulations too, but better than having no access.
This path of requiring certification to do something in public is in general a bad idea. But EVEN if one agrees with it, why make it EXCLUSIVE to one FOR PROFIT organization? I vigorously disagree. I am strongly against the proposed ban in Miami but urge everyone to consider this IKO exclusivity before signing.
This subject came up 4 years ago ; i said about the same thing as "slowboat"
that it was a REALLY BAD idea, to let a for profit origination take control
over kite boarding. I suggested that the Kite community, world wide, make it's
own club, with a regulation system,that was flexible enough to adjust the
rules according to local needs, (( and it was non profit )) for the kiters and
by the kiters.

If IKO gets a foot-hold to the point they can control the kiting community
then you can expect the club dues to go up dramatically in the future.

Kiters NEED to get off their ASS'es ; and start their own world-wide
or country wide club
that has the power to deal with issues like what's going on now, in this Thread.
Individual local clubs ,simply don't have the power to deal with government alone ;
Ya got to band together.

I will NOT join IKO, (rather fly my HG instead) ; and you really should read some
of these posts and Threads by kiwimike+iko, before you give IKO your money

http://www.kiteforum.com/search.php?key ... wimike+iko

@ Kitemanmuc

In the short term ; how about you make your own club, and have your
own club instructors, charge visitors to join , before they are legally
allowed to kite on the beaches that you and your mates worked so hard
to keep open ? If they can't kite ; then they can leave or get arrested.

That is EXACTLY what would happen if you went to Torry pines in San Diego,
and tried to fly with no membership to the local club, and without proof of
insurance.

Once again --- LETTING, ( IKO ) control your outcome ; it's a Really BAD idea !! :nono:


Bille
What you are suggesting sounds fantastic, and the general idea you are proposing is exactly what we are pushing, but IKO 3 or equivalent is a request the Neighborhood Association is requiring or they will not support kiteboarding. If the Neighborhood Associating does not support kiteboarding. Its gone. Done. History. We will not get the support of the City Manager or the Commissioners. Then there will only be 1 spot on Miami Beach, and that spot is a private concession that requires IKO 3. So do the other 2 spots in Miami-Dade county. So wither we require IKO 3 or equivalent. Or the sport is ban. We have been working on this day and night since November, have had meeting with Commissioners, the Mayor, City manager, HOA presidents, had workshops with residents, chamber of commers and kiters, been to neighborhood association meetings and met personally with hundreds of non-kiting residents who are against it. They did their homework and found IKO 3 and brought the requirement to the table as they say PADI or NAUI is required for scuba and fishing license for fisherman, so kiters should require the same. Its is what it is. Its like some above have said.

IKO 3 or Equivalent

or

Nothing

Which do you choose?


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