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12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

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Matteo V
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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby Matteo V » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:34 pm

bigtone667 wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:19 pm
A new kiter will not appreciate any of what you are saying. It takes time to figure out that less can be more (usually a lot of time and a hydrofoil).
Not to confuse low resistance kiting (hydrofoil, skateboard, ice skates/runners, hardpack/icy snowkiting, buggy), with high resistance kiting (planing boards, displacement vessels, mountain boards in grass). Hydrofoiling is capable of less kite size due to the flatter resistance curve of the hydrofoil.

My point relates to non-hydrofoil boards.

But I do agree with you that it takes experience/time to figure out that you can utilize a smaller kite if you have built that skill set. Personally, I simply went for smaller gear when I was starting out - which could have been bad for my continuation, but wound up being good for developing skill.

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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby iriejohn » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:25 pm

bigtone667 wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:19 pm
A new kiter will not appreciate any of what you [Matteo V] are saying.
Indeed

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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby grigorib » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:50 pm

Come on guys. OP had a simple question - 12m or 14m for 200 lbs and 14-21knots of wind. He’s a beginner, assumed riding a twintip.

While many dealers would suggest 14m as a safe bet you know that a smaller kite with a larger board is a better combination.
So 12m should be fine, and once he rides better he’ll feel bored on the 12m as it is a slower size.

Anyone who keeps riding doesn’t stay with one kite/board though, so from future perspective 14 is better for 10-17 knots while 11m will do great in target 14-21 range.

Only thing I’d suggest for sure to a beginner - a door board. That will get more hours on water covered and it’s a thing he’ll keep

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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby iriejohn » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:12 pm

grigorib wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:50 pm
Come on guys. OP had a simple question - 12m or 14m for 200 lbs and 14-21knots of wind. He’s a beginner, assumed riding a twintip.

While many dealers would suggest 14m as a safe bet you know that a smaller kite with a larger board is a better combination.
So 12m should be fine, and once he rides better he’ll feel bored on the 12m as it is a slower size.

Anyone who keeps riding doesn’t stay with one kite/board though, so from future perspective 14 is better for 10-17 knots while 11m will do great in target 14-21 range.

Only thing I’d suggest for sure to a beginner - a door board. That will get more hours on water covered and it’s a thing he’ll keep
The OP's simple question was pretty much answered in the first 10 or so posts where a general consensus emerged.

Matteo V
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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby Matteo V » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:37 pm

grigorib wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:50 pm
.....Anyone who keeps riding doesn’t stay with one kite/board though, so from future perspective 14 is better for 10-17 knots while 11m will do great in target 14-21 range......
Yup, and that was my initial point. You need to look at your future quiver to see if there is a conflict. Sometimes a 17m's range overlaps the 14m's, but rarely the 12m's range. So go 12m now, maybe 17m for your next kite, then a 9-10m after that. But a 14m could be redundant at many locations that also necessitate a 17m. So the answer to the question is a bit more complicated than your average kiter would take it as. Think ahead, save some money, realize that this is a forum with lots of different views, and make your best effort of presenting evidence for your views.

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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby Kamikuza » Mon Mar 12, 2018 5:24 am

grigorib wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:50 pm
Come on guys. OP had a simple question - 12m or 14m for 200 lbs and 14-21knots of wind. He’s a beginner, assumed riding a twintip.

While many dealers would suggest 14m as a safe bet you know that a smaller kite with a larger board is a better combination.
So 12m should be fine, and once he rides better he’ll feel bored on the 12m as it is a slower size.

Anyone who keeps riding doesn’t stay with one kite/board though, so from future perspective 14 is better for 10-17 knots while 11m will do great in target 14-21 range.

Only thing I’d suggest for sure to a beginner - a door board. That will get more hours on water covered and it’s a thing he’ll keep
Yeh but that would have been a boring thread.

I was home to suggest a 12 and the biggest TT he could find, but didn't want to face the back lash 😁 I don't use my Door now, because even that requires big kites, and anyway, winds that require gear like that just isn't fun with gear like that for me anymore.

Depending on your location, and how quickly you learn, and how much spending money or selling bothers you, you might get a couple of years out of a door then not ever use it again.

You can plan your quiver better than I did (check my shed!) but there's inevitably going to be some shuffling. I still think it's worth buying an oldish kite and a door to beat on while learning...

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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby bigtone667 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:54 am

+1 Kev.

Matteo V
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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby Matteo V » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:58 pm

Kamikuza wrote:
Mon Mar 12, 2018 5:24 am
I was home to suggest a 12 and the biggest TT he could find, but didn't want to face the back lash 😁
As I have said afore, this is a forum - so suggest away! And I agree with this advice if the OP is in certain locations. A good fit for this advice would be if 12m was the biggest kite the locals were using, even in light winds. The big board could help out with progression, and you would have your largest kite purchased upfront. The only downside is that you would be starting out on 'the biggest' kite for that location. Typically, I shy away from giving that advice unless the potential kiter is going to purchase the next size smaller at the same time.

Kamikuza wrote:
Mon Mar 12, 2018 5:24 am
I don't use my Door now, because even that requires big kites, and anyway, winds that require gear like that just isn't fun with gear like that for me anymore.
Wind snobbery was a big factor in killing windsurfing. The happiest, least snobbish kiters I know, will go out with me in anything. I just got my first 3.5m session last fall and loved that I got out, but would rather stay on 5.5m winds. Still, I will keep the 3.5m to save another 50knot steady (never really steady) day. Granted, the hydrofoil is changing the light wind scene a bit with regards to kite size, and no one has a well evidenced prediction of where that will go. So don't limit your time on the water and thus skill by going to a 2 kite quiver when you find your favorite wind speed. Keep an open mind about those wind speeds you don't like. Get out of your comfort zone and take the time to build the skills to have fun in those other winds. Kites are more fun across the entire range of wind than even windsurfers were, so use that advantage to be out more. Go out and have fun, but stay safe.....by giving it 8 years or so before you go out on a 3.5m in winds that justify that size.

And Kami, don't worry about the "back lash 😁" or validation. Your opinion is valued here and you should seek to prove that it is as founded as you are convinced it is. Only by presenting your evidence, and having it challenged, can you find out if you are correct in your assumptions and reasoning.

bigtone667
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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby bigtone667 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:48 pm

Out of interest, Matteo, what is your weight, board, wind speed, kite type when you are using your 5.5m kite?

AdroVempo
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Re: 12m or 14m Slingshot Rally for 200 lbs riders ??

Postby AdroVempo » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:00 pm

Thanks for all the info guys. To be honest, I am sure somewhat overwhelmed by all the data. But I think I understand the contrasting viewpoints here.

Not that you all were not good in guiding me, but just for an easier decision, I called Slingshot themselves and the guy there was suggesting 12m. He said :

"When you are on the verge of 12m vs 14m, meaning...when there is a possibility that 12m could work for your size and conditions, then always better to choose that over 14m, just because of the agility (and less air to pump, though I am not concerned much about that piece)."

He also added: "the fact that you felt under-powered might be because you were on the Switchblade, but Rallys are known for their low-end grunt and constant pull. Switchblade, somewhat like the RPM, needs a tad more wind". - Now this could just be him being 'The Slingshot sales guy scoring a point over Cabrinha'. :)

I still agree with most folks here that I should consider a 17m in the future.


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