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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:04 pm 
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Quote:
On 2002-11-03 21:53, Pedro Marcos wrote:
Johnny ive seen a 2003 fuel today and the chicken loop doesnt have any safety system.

All the bars the dealer have here none have quick release. When does that new bar come out?


Sorry, didn't see this question. Monday(tomorrow) I will find out for you exactley when the 2003 SS bar will be widely available.

Johnny


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:09 pm 
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If you want to use a normal hook wouldn't it be easier to exert your strength by pulling down on the trim so the depower fell out of the hook then let go instead of pushing down on the depower loop?
I still think the prolimit is safer though, only drawback it has is it don't turn, but it wouldn't be easy to hook in or out of a hook that turned.
Basically like this I can hook out by pulling the bar down, ok kite will be full power but I can lift my weight, or I can release the hook.

I windsufered for years and I did some pretty powered moves while hooked in but anytime I was in doubt or in a sticky situation or trying anything new I was unhooked and ready to let go, what i ask myself is this, if I wouldn't hook myself to a windsurf sail why should I attach myself to a traction kite even semi-permanently? A traction kite is way more dangerous than a windsurfing sail.
Kiting, I wanna be able to kook out if I want/have to.

Jo

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Mr Jo Macdonald on 2002-11-03 23:12 ]</font>


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:13 pm 
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Quote:
On 2002-11-03 22:33, tomtom wrote:
Sorry for bad english i hope that you understand me

I have not try yet. And unfortunately it was not test in any magazin or... for relase power. But i hold one in my hand in shop and i have very good feeling because it was very very simple and this is most important. It is very cheep in europe 39 euro. I did not like QR chicken loop. I have two Naish and Flysurfer it works but: I dont want find relase triger in panic and i want keep chicken loop simple and small. Other reason

I have different four kite until now

On every i have 3 different QR system

What you thing about is this normal situation?

In panic i must first remember whitch one i use a how it works because every work on different princip. etc...

I thing QR must be harness based. This is also AIRUSH policy.

One QR to every kite one system one reflex!

To shackled unshackled:

I think that shackle is dangerous but i also thing that unwanted drop chicken loop while waterrestart or jump is also dangerous.But you say that is not prob for you

So i think somenthing between like wipika chicken loop with center rope is good.

But like i say in other tread wipika based QR (takoon, gaastra, wipika, mauimagic) was labor tested in german magazin like unfunctionable and dangerous (huge relase power).

So in my opinien ideal QR until now does not exist.

It must by (for me)
Harnes based
Very simple and reliable
have hook not shacle
and have option to fix chicken loop when kiter want




I think we are understanding your English well enough. Thanks for your input. I think you for sure would be way ahead in the game to get the quick release spreader bar.(starting to sound like the sensible soultion for me too to back up the inline one on the chicken loop). Having to deal with 3 different kinds depending on which kite you are flying is a bit crazy bro. You REALLY need to do something about this real soon before you do need to deploy one of them. Trust me, you ARE NOT going to have time to think about how, or which one, or any of that. Get one system/method and go with it so it will become second nature for you. NO TIME FOR THINKING!

Johnny


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:18 pm 
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Yeah, imo a safety system and the bar in general should be as simple as possible


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:22 pm 
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Quote:
On 2002-11-03 23:09, Mr Jo Macdonald wrote:
If you want to use a normal hook wouldn't it be easier to exert your strength by pulling down on the trim so the depower fell out of the hook then let go instead of pushing down on the depower loop?
I still think the prolimit is safer though, only drawback it has is it don't turn, but it wouldn't be easy to hook in or out of a hook that turned.
Basically like this I can hook out by pulling the bar down, ok kite will be full power but I can lift my weight, or I can release the hook.

I windsufered for years and I did some pretty powered moves while hooked in but anytime I was in doubt or in a sticky situation or trying anything new I was unhooked and ready to let go, what i ask myself is this, if I wouldn't hook myself to a windsurf sail why should I attach myself to a traction kite even semi-permanently? A traction kite is way more dangerous than a windsurfing sail.
Kiting, I wanna be able to kook out if I want/have to.

Jo



Yeah Jo, maybe you are right about it being easier or a better use of my strength, but I wasn't thinking, I was reacting. Right now I am thinking about how I reacted and translating that into words on your screen. Maybe if I had time to think about it at the time it was happening I would have acted a bit differ, I dunno. What's really important to me at this point is that my reflexes were accurate enough to get me out of the shit, and pretty damn quick at that!

I am agreeing with you more and more...the QR spreader bar seems to be the way to go. I may even start using one as a backup for the inline one on the chicken loop.

Although I have never windsurfed, I agree with you 100% about being able to kook out when you want. That's the main basis of our crusade too isn't it? I will NEVER shackle in. And I practice using the BEST QR we have too. Antyime I feel danger is approaching, I will totally unhook and hold the bar just in my hands. NO QR will ever outperform your HANDS as a QR.

Johnny


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:30 pm 
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Yep, if you're scared and/or about to get hurt by something approching fast unshackling isn't instictive, letting go is.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2002 12:01 am 
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WOW! Hey Jo, I think we've blown this thread into about as big as two guys can. We prolly would have been better to do phone call or IRC chat or something similar. HEY!!!! That gives me a GREAT idea! When's Toby coming back home?

Anyway, I was just checking this thread again before I log out and shut this beyatch down for a bit!

We still wanna hear input from the rest of you out there!

Johnny


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2002 12:05 am 
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1- Non QR chicken is a call for problems.
2- Shackes mounted at the harness with the release swivelling are not safe. The release rope or ball or wathever has to be in a fixed and consistent position.
3- Found a reliable method and, the most important thing, train your brain on how to release.
I always use my QR when landing, just for practice. Try to make a mental picture of where the release is everytime. It has to be as natural as the brake pedal in your car.
Is better let it go a second early than late.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2002 8:42 am 
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Location: Seattle ish
Do you guys carry hook knives?
And...No, I'm not talking about the tiny plastic toys that DaKine hides behind your back.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2002 8:53 am 
Had a small accident 4 months ago. I fly with a Tylaska Quick release. The problem I had was on an X2 12 meter. I folded over a wing tip and lost all steering. The kite started looping out of control and like most people I had the idea pull oposite bar to stop the looping. I was dumped onto the beach 3 times from about 25 feet breaking both my Arms one at the wrist and the other just below the ball joint in my shoulder. There was nothing wrong with the quick release the problem was not using it. However when I did decide to trip the release I had two broken arms, the release worked fine and had I not had a release I would never have been able to get away from the kite.


John


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