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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2002 3:53 pm 
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Willdo but I'm sure he'll catch you here


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 2:51 am 
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Riding leashless is inexcuseable IMO. It's not just your kite at risk, but like i think murdoc said, you are being a potential killer. When I help someone launch, I DO say "Hey, you forgot your leash!" If they say naw, I'm not wearing one, I then tell them "Well, then you aren't ready to be launched yet" and I drop their kite and walk away.

For the record, I can do one hell of alot of shit with a leash attached to me. IF I want to try something like a handle pass or other that would be hindered by my leash, i go way WAY away from everyone else, WAY offshore, and disconnect it for the trick attempt. After I do it or try it, I reconnect the leash. You CAN be a stylish rider being leashed up!

Also, if I have my ski or boat on the water or beach...or even if I dont, and a leashless rider loses his kite, my boat, my ski and ME are off limits to him for retrieving it. I damn sure did set and watch a kite get blown out to sea while my ski was setting there idle and ready to go get it. The guy was furious at me for not chasing it for him and wouldnt shut up about it and even resorted to name calling...but I told him basically that "he needs to SHUT UP and get the Phuck out of my face. You made the decision to ride leashless, so now YOU will deal with that decision and it's consequences, NOT ME!"

Everyone around me knows how I stand on this too. One time, a leashless rider lost his kite and it was down blowing downwind, headed my way. He shouted at me to please try to catch it for him(while I was riding) since I was the only one left downwind of the kite. SO, I approached it with much caution, and when I got to it, I jumped over it, keft it lay to blow off and rode away. Again, this almost led to a fight on the beach, but I told him the same i tell them all as I said above. YOUR kite is not MY PROBLEM...unless it becomes entangled in my kite. THEN, if I can, I'll just cut your loose and let it go if that's an option.

I rider responsibly and I expect the same from those around me. Those who dont...they pay. It may take some time, but they will pay. And slowly but surely, I am having an impact on the area. What used to be somethign like 90% leashless with 10% using leashes, has now become something more to the effect of 95% using leashes. We have now less than 10 riding leashless. They are all slowly but surely getting the picture. You CAN have some influence on the people around you, and especially if you are a higher profile rider in that area. Be a role model and set some examples!


Johnny


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 11:35 am 
dude, i cant wait for you to come over to the uk, man with an attitude like we'd cut your lines and let all your kit drift out to sea.

i can't believe that you would do nothing to help someone who stands to loose $1000 worth of kit, just becasue they made a bad descision that they may later come to regret and understand.

seriously i hope you get mugged and have the shirt taken off your back, all becasue you got a good suntan, you must have money or something worth stealing if you have a suntan.

shit i would just walk on by.


seriously what you've said is the most unfriendly, likely to put someone of starting this sport i've seen in three years. you may be a honcho at home, but everyone i've shown this too in the uk thinks you are a prick.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 11:57 am 
i prefer not rescuing a kite from no leash kiter than rescuing it and next time it tangles in my kite and puts me in danger or kills my kid on the beach - jane


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:22 pm 
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Location: Munich, Germany
Quote:
On 2002-11-06 11:35, Anonymous wrote:
dude, i cant wait for you to come over to the uk, man with an attitude like we'd cut your lines and let all your kit drift out to sea.

i can't believe that you would do nothing to help someone who stands to loose $1000 worth of kit, just becasue they made a bad descision that they may later come to regret and understand.

seriously i hope you get mugged and have the shirt taken off your back, all becasue you got a good suntan, you must have money or something worth stealing if you have a suntan.

shit i would just walk on by.


seriously what you've said is the most unfriendly, likely to put someone of starting this sport i've seen in three years. you may be a honcho at home, but everyone i've shown this too in the uk thinks you are a prick.


I think Johnny is strict but fair. It's not like he hasn't spoken to the people before, from what I could gather.
Unfortunately, in kiting it is necessary to be more aggressive towards people behaving irresponsibly, since your mistakes have such a big impact on other people.

It's always easy to ignore the sensible option and then be sorry about it afterwards. If there is no credible threat to misbehaviour, people won't be sticking to good practices. It's like the drunk driver saying "I will never drive drunk again" after running someone over.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:31 pm 
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Quote:
On 2002-11-06 12:22, jever98 wrote:
It's like the drunk driver saying "I will never drive drunk again" after running someone over.


very good example, Nico.
Don't act after something happened,do it before!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 1:59 pm 
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Location: Hamburg, Germany
I think the only way to address this is from the business side.
The pro riders get their money from us, the customers, in the end.

I have in the past, but it won't buy anymore kiteboarding magazins, where the majority of pictures (most importantly the coverpage picture) show riders without the most basic safety.

Especially the last few issues of one of our local magazins are nothing but disgusting

Image

Once I am offered the choice of buying from a company that supports safety in kiteboarding, this would be one of the deciding facts for choosing new gear. Unfortunately nearly all companies ignore safety so far, so this is not an option, YET.

The pro riders will do whatever they have to to get their money.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 5:46 pm 
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Great Topic and ditto reactions!(that's a.o. why I like this forum!)

I've put "Murdoc's" question on a dutch forum http://www.kitesurf.nl and it at least makes people think again about safety.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sake on 2002-11-06 17:48 ]</font>


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 6:29 pm 
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Yeah, it can be pretty easy to get personal about a subject like this, your own personal safety, nothing more personal than that really.
However I think that if you seriously think about it you might agree that it isn't just a question of your own safety though, but also of those around you.
Like I said before it's also a very touchy subject because it's easy to read into someone's post "you're a jerk if you don't wear a leash" even if they didn't actually say that, and just as easy to reply, "Who the fuck are you to tell me what to do nice person?" or whatever in the heat of the moment.
Imo the important thing is to talk about it and always be prepared to learn and willing to try a system which just might be a bit better than what you're using now, for you or for everyone, and not just in kiting either. that's the way i reason, but each to their own in the end.
Obviously everyone makes up their own mind how they ride, just as they decide how they drive, right? Many peole might say it's stupid to drive drunk and there's even a law against it but how many of us have NEVER done that? Been there, done that.
Maybe some of us have done it but have then learnt in time that it ain't really so cool.

Mr Anonymous brit, as you have something to say I would like to ask you 2 favours man, I know it's a bit much but see what ya think.
Here goes.
It would be great if you could get yourself an ID, then I'd know who I'm talkin to, doesn't have to be your real name and it also gives you the chance to edit your posts and ignore the old stuff, makes it a lot faster to read through the tons o stuff.
Also it's clear to everyone that you have a beef with Johnny and not agreeing with someone is fine but he just had an accident man, take it easy for a while, be cool. Or say it on a one-on-one basis.

Hey if you get yourself an ID you can be our original bad attitude, don't think we got one yet, hmm, maybe a few candidates but anyway wadaya say?

Jo


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2002 6:48 pm 
Can't we all just get along?
Roddney Kiting


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