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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 3:41 pm 
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I asked this in another thread but got no answer.
Fokiten said oversheeting is useless, does this go for all kites or just front liners? I would like to know whether a back line flyer turns fastest with the tips even or slightly oversheeted (ie flying more on the back lines).
Is there no reason to oversheet a back liner (SS Fuel)? No more power (less actually sounds like), turns slower, flies further back in the window?
Until now I've been flying the fuels so that all 4 lines are tight with the depower at the bar and this means that the last 5 cm of depower near the bar slightly oversheets the kite and they seem to fly ok like this or is it better to have the tips even with the depower at the bar?

One thing I've noticed is that when the kite turns with the bar fully powered the tip I'm pulling on (by pulling that side of the bar down) flares more than the other which obviosly has the line looser with that end of the bar higher.

Ta chaps
Jo


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Mr Jo Macdonald on 2002-11-07 15:59 ]</font>


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 5:32 pm 
Hi jo, I fly AB's there frontliners and have no extended time on backliners, so my opinion is limited but accurate for AB's. furthermore I noticed that my 11.8 was getting powered from the appaent wind blowin the slack out of my backline's and keepin that big mo fo powered all the time. Who needs that not me. I made my own bridals so i don't know how much i added the the rear over stock but it think it was signifficant. as i get better with my jumps and transitions i find my kite is much faster and so better when sheeted out a tad, here a tip. sail on a reach in full power trim position and try to over sheet,if you can then choke down the depower cleat and repeat, when you have achived minimum oversheet potential, note the amount of depower you had to apply and then just add this lenght to your rear pigs. Bingo perfect trim, no oversheet possible, maxdepower achived, and a tuned kite. let me know what you think for your SS. fo


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 5:39 pm 
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Thanks fo, I still want to here from anyone who's flying backliners whether they think slightly oversheeting and therefore flaring the tips slows the kite turning.
I can't believe no one knows, maybe I'm just asking a stupid question and will have to find out for myself.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 6:50 pm 
jo no problamo,just speculation, backline riders tend not to quite as sharp as us highly refined frontliners, er er er that ought to do it for you! glad to help! fo


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 7:06 pm 
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Hi fo, yeah I know, have a lot of Abs, X2s and Supertyypes around here. the RRD beats the pants off the lot of em btw, turns like it son a spindle. Even when it's diving for the drink, just pull on one side of the bar and it spins round, brilliant.
Only thing is though that the 19m RRD need more wind than my 16 Fuel to get goin :wink:.
16m X2 seems to do ok at the bottom end surprisingly enough.

Actually i think I might of thought it out, could you here the gears turnin?

OK, here goes.

With a backline flyer when all the lines are taught with the kite at zenith the tips flare out as the kite oversheets slightly. However, when you pull the bar one way, even if it's still zero depower/full power as above you are shortening one line, (therefore making it flare/turn towards the side you're pulling), and lengthening the other depowering this line as the bar goes up past the position it was when the kite was at zenith, therefore the outer tip that has to fly further around the tip you're pulling on isn't flared because it's just flying on the front line.

Therefore having it slightly oversheeted at zenith is ok, because the tip that has to turn won't be oversheeted when you pull down on the oposite side of the bar.

How does that sound?



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Mr Jo Macdonald on 2002-11-07 19:08 ]</font>


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 7:34 pm 
Hey Jo, thats exactly right, and if you think about it it answers the turning quesstion. Fact: the sheeted out side speeds around the sheeted inside. Fact: sheetedout is faster than sheetin. Come on you backline power freaks respond, or are you too busy addmiring your forarms.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 8:41 pm 
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Quote:
On 2002-11-07 17:32, fokiten wrote:
I made my own bridals so i don't know how much i added the the rear over stock but it think it was signifficant.


Hi, fokiten.
How do you rig the bridles? I m using the stock ones with a 11.8 and sometimes I thought about changing the bridle in order to increase back line pressure. (moving the connection point of the backline at hte front upwards??)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2002 9:10 pm 
hey hernan, I have thought about the physcis of the bridal setup, but my brain just overheats and starts smokin, so i stopped, and just took a shot, I started from this point. Kite face down leadline inline with leading edge (if you site up the lead you see the lead as inline with the leading edge as it forms the wing of the kite also on plane meaning on the ground.)Now everything else is right if it converges on this line, the backline starts here goes thu the pulley returns to this point.The re launch line is right(no or little slack) when installed on the rearline and attached to the strut and the rear line is pulled tight to this line. All lines should be tight and the front and rear terminnate at the same point on this line. This only ballpark from here you have to tune to suit your needs. hope this helps. fo


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2002 6:21 am 
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Hey Jo

I used to fly ARX's and they are sorta back line..... I also fly AEROs...

And yes oversheeting them slows them down heaps.....

In the next few weeks I'm gonna be simulating the power steering of the Wipi bridles by increasing the mech advantage of the bar (rear lines in from the end of bar, giving 2:1 force increase)...

BLOWN AWAY


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2002 10:56 am 
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Thanks man,
I can't beliiiiiiiiieve no one except you and fo had anything to say about this.
Anyway, so you reckon best settup is so the kite doesn't oversheet even slightly when the bar is fully powered?
Or to keep the setup like this so you can get more lift and turn the kite slightly depowered (so the tips are even if it was at zenith)?
Jo


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