North 07, 08 and 09 5th element bar concerns

[FELIPEUY]

Hi to all…

Just wanted to post some concerns I am having regarding the 2007, 2008 and 2009 5th element bar…

1) Although I owned a 2007 5th element bar, I couldn’t get pics from it since I sold it a year ago… but, I remember a weak point in it’s design which I believe is being reproduced on the 2009 bar (but not on the 2008 bar…)
On the other hand when i got my 2008 bar, I noticed that North had made the hole in the center of the bar much bigger than 2007 bar, so the depower line dind’s suffer as much wear in the 2008 bar as in the 2007 bar.
To my surprise in the 2009 bar I recently got, that same hole is once again in a similar size as 2007 bar… so what’s happening???
2) The 2008 and the 2009 bar have IMHO a design problem that is a point in the line that holds the front leader lines with Vario Cleat lineloop.
This line (White coloured) has the 5th line that passes through it in a couple of points.
In this points, the White line suffers from a huge wear that in my case ended up in the broken line that needs a replacement.2009 bar has the same two points and in my case I am seeing that the same process is happening (and unluckily I know the end of the story…)

Not all is bad news…

Some improvements are:

• Better grip (much ticker one) so my hands feel better alter each session (I don’t like to use gloves)

• Better leader line floaters

• Improved donkey dick that it doesn’t appear that it will break in the middle as the 2008 did.

• Velcro to tie the depower line (hopper) so it won't mess up with the bar (it happened that in some situations, you this line could mess up with the bar and made it difficult to power the kite again i.e: pull the bar)

My proposed solution for the white line wear problem is:

1. Loosen a bit the 5th line so it is not tensioned while you are kiting

.

• Attach some plastic case in the points where the 5th line passes through the White line (I believe that a pen ink plastic that is cut through and then attached can be used) I’’ try to get this done and post some pics

Cheers and thanks for reading

Buenos vientos!!

2008 and 2009 bar... difficult to see, but the 2009 bar has a smaller center hole than 2008 bar.

Other pass through point...

Explanation parts

LG_08North_5thElementParts.jpg (74.27 KiB) Viewed 2248 times

[icebird]

You can't loosen the 5th line tension because it helps the shape of at least the Rebel and Vegas kites, and in light of recent Rebel 09 events you probably want more tension not less. Probably not an issue on Evo, but then it might also wear less? See also recent thread on North Bar pressure. It also carries your entire weight on the harness, and there are some basic physiological principles in play.


I don't know about hole size. I have had both 07 and 08 bars and didn't notice, but I was happy with the much improved lines of 08 that doesn't filter. Some people report frequent wear on the depower line while I haven't noticed anything. Might depend on rider weight and whether you dip the bar in water when starting out.

But coating the center of the bar makes sense. Slingshot apparently did this for 09, but havent seen it. As to other wear. There is a number of ways like thicker line, better load distribution, doubling the lines where there is more wear etc. but ultimately it is a tradeoff between being uncluttered and efficient.

Mikkel

[FELIPEUY]

You can't loosen the 5th line tension because it helps the shape of at least the Rebel and Vegas kites, and in light of recent Rebel 09 events you probably want more tension not less.

Yep icebird... I totally agree... but if you do not loosen a bit the 5th line, you'll surely end up with the same problem i had...

As of the 2008 bar, it has a better design in the center hole, resulting in lees wear in the depower line... but unfortunately North didn't keep that hole size in 2009 bar...

[Tweaky]

Still riding my 07 bar with original lines, while a friend had to replace his after a few weeks. The difference? I melt candle wax in a jar, placed in a pot of water on the stove and then paint the fraying lines with hot wax. Do this every 5-10 sessions and they'll last forever. Just treat the fraying bits. Hope that helps? Ted

[-Cedric-]

I have no complaints about the North bar except for the Safety Leash and Grip:

1) On the 07 bar, the safety leash buckle that connect your leash to your 5th line opens way to quickly while surfing! Once I made a crash, and when I was riding again, I noticed that this buckle had come loose and I had NO SAFETY at that moment ... If I had to pull my 5th in that situation my kite would have been gone! I therefor now bought a Naish Torch 10 next to my North Rebel 14m because Naish does have a good leash ... the further motives why I chose for the Torch, for the type of riding style I want to grow into, I don't need to tell, but this leash just bothered me alot! I didn't gave me safe fealing to learn new tricks unhooked! I think I saw that North still uses the same buckle, or is this already replaced?

2) Also I think that the grip of North has always been something for improvement... To hard in my oppinion ... I always used to have blisters after riding for a couple of hours ...

Good luck!

[icebird]

Yeah the buckle is not the strongest. Cheaper to buy a Prolimit leash than a new Torch though.
It is also possible to Quick Release accidentally (if you try hard enough during a crash), and I've seen my kite getting busy downwind before resting on the beach because buckle didn't hold.

The original leash will also polish your lower thigh bone after a good month in board shorts.
Blisters ... I am not kiting enough then? I got the good advice not to hold tight onto bar, just let the fingers rest.

[baller]

You can't loosen the 5th line tension because it helps the shape of at least the Rebel and Vegas kites,

Actually, because of the ball on the 5th at the Y, you can be as loose as you want on the 5th, it will not affect 5th line tension to the kite.

[-Cedric-]

Yeah the buckle is not the strongest. Cheaper to buy a Prolimit leash than a new Torch though.
It is also possible to Quick Release accidentally (if you try hard enough during a crash), and I've seen my kite getting busy downwind before resting on the beach because buckle didn't hold.

The original leash will also polish your lower thigh bone after a good month in board shorts.
Blisters ... I am not kiting enough then? I got the good advice not to hold tight onto bar, just let the fingers rest.

Of course that's a lot cheaper ! But as I said saying why I bought the torch for other reasons than the bar wasn't the point in this conversation ... I needed a smaller kite anyway and went for Naish instead of North because of these safety reasons, that's the point I want to make here ... Small things can make the change for customers ... And also just because it is an awesome kite in 09 again! I can't wait to test this baby and learn some sick new things!!

[icebird]

You can't loosen the 5th line tension because it helps the shape of at least the Rebel and Vegas kites,

Actually, because of the ball on the 5th at the Y, you can be as loose as you want on the 5th, it will not affect 5th line tension to the kite.

Correct, the 5th is slack below the Y and the load transfer to the front line - depower system. This is also where the lines are getting worn.

My comment on shaping the front does not really make sense because the load below the Y is always decided by the riders weight on the harness and pull of the kite. All you do above the Y is moving load from the front lines to the center 5th (and it is this load distribution that is wrong on Rebel 09 apparently).

[outsider]

Hey guy's

It's a little off topic but I am gona ask anyway.

I have a 07 north bar and I ride it with Rebel07 14m.Now I bought a new Rhino08 10m(kite only) and want to fly it on a 07 Rebel's bar.
With Rhino came 408cm line attached to a nose of my Rhino(where 5th line attaches).What do I do with it?
Could you explain to me what should I change on my 07 bar so I can ride it on my Rebel and on my Rhino.

thanks