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Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

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Tvillegus
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Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby Tvillegus » Sun Jun 13, 2010 3:45 am

Hey all, here is a quick question for Wainman Hawaii riders.

I'm having issues with the deployment of the safety on my boss 12m. I've only had the kite out 4 or 5 times so far and noticed this problem when trying to self land today.

I have run the frontline extension line that was supplied with the kite from one of the front lines (larks headed above the stopper ball, through the bar and down the the ring on the chicken loop, see picture).

Image

There are two problems i see with this setup:

1. when deploying the safety, the line pulls through until the frontline stopper ball hits the bar hole and stays put. This only "shortens" the front line it is attached to by around 8 inches, which does sweet f#&@ all when depowering the kite.

2. the swivel cannot turn when doing rotations as the extension line will wrap arount the chicken loop line and prevent the swivel from turning.

I've tried to think of possible solutions, but come up empty (short of starting from scratch and making my own bar setup.)

What have people out there been doing to solve this problem?

Thanks heaps,

Gus.

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kitenaked
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Postby kitenaked » Sun Jun 13, 2010 4:52 am

Don't use the mini 5th.

Tvillegus
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Re:

Postby Tvillegus » Sun Jun 13, 2010 5:37 am

kitenaked wrote:Don't use the mini 5th.


Thanks for the enlightening response kitenaked, however i'm looking for a solution which allows me to hook the safety in under the bar so i can ride comfortably without having to untangle my bar from my leash whenever i want to spin it.

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magnus_norway
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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby magnus_norway » Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:35 am

Tvillegus wrote:1. when deploying the safety, the line pulls through until the frontline stopper ball hits the bar hole and stays put. This only "shortens" the front line it is attached to by around 8 inches, which does sweet f#&@ all when depowering the kite.

2. the swivel cannot turn when doing rotations as the extension line will wrap arount the chicken loop line and prevent the swivel from turning.

For your 1st problem: This is something that will always happen as long as you have a "large" attachment point for your mini-fifth, like a ring or a ball etc... You need to figure out a different way of attaching the extension line to the front line. Look at the way Slingshot or I think Naish attaches it. You want a sort of small knot which can sit inside a ball or another attachment point of the front line, which when the safety is engaged, lets the ball follow the bar along the front line, making the kite flag onto that line...

Your 2nd problem is a more common problem. This is something that in theory has been solved by Slingshot's new swivel for the 2010 bar. You either need a swivel where the front line extension goes through the swivel, or a swivel below the bar that you can manually turn to untwist the extension line

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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby jochi » Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:40 am

Hey gus,

I see the problem here, i would say the best depower set up is to take the mini fifth and hook that to the actual swivel. That will give you even depower if you let go of the bar. If the ?!-/$& hits the fan you can release the leash at the harness point. There have been some mods out there, but other than that, you could hook the leash directly to the red plastic loop at the end of the front line to give you true one hundred precent depower, but you cannot pass it through the hole in the bar. Then If you release the kite will fly on one line and loop a couple times and it might be hard to relaunch but you can then self rescue. The set up I ride is suicide with the leash hooked to the chicken loop using the steel ring. If i eject the kite is gone which is my preference. If i just let go theree is enough depower without the Mini 5th line and that is the setting kite naked is talking about. I had the same issues as you when i got the kites 2 yrs ago, but I did away with the 5th line and believe full eject is the way to go. You can also just click the leash above the chick loop below the bar and then have the ultimate release on the harness side at the leash release even if you hit the quick release on the chick loop.

The kites are great, and the bar one of the simplest out there. That philosophy will create some issues for newer riders, but you can mod the bar....check hangloss or you could buy the naish bar which should work. Perhaps they will update the bar but just know that the safety system is a bit different on these higher performance kites. The idea is to keep it simple without hard parts. It's actually safer than most people think, but I'll admit that there are other bars out there that might be better for some people.

J

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wondamic
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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby wondamic » Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:49 am

Jochi has it right. :thumb: The bars are simple yet effective. No mechanical bull spit to deal with or worry about. I teach and ride with my leash attached right above the chicken loop. Check photo...

You have plenty of depower this way, especially if you don't move your stopper ball down. But even if you do, I've never had an issue. The only potential down side might be losing the chicken loop upon release. I've lost a couple of loops that way. So now, when I teach my students how to self-rescue, I make sure the loop is still attached, or I remove it and shove it between my suit and harness before I take in the lines. :cool2:
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Frankieboy
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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby Frankieboy » Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:52 am

I use a naish bar withe my WH's
The stock bar sucks. The depower is too short

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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby sw67 » Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:55 am

I dont use the mini 5th line but my understanding of it is that you connect it to the ring below the swivel. I clip the leash to the depower rope above the c-loop and for self landing land at the edge of the window and pull on the upper front line to get it to fall on the beach facing the wind.

In normal riding within the kites windrange the depower is enough for safety but if you are worried leash direct to a front line before coming in to self land

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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby flipper231 » Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:03 pm

?This is the reason why I do not buy WH... Too pretentious, read the website, their safety is letting go of the bar.... But what if it screws up at launch? What if a squall passes by? What if a line tangles and you get stuck in a death spin?... Letting the kite go completely is sometimes possible but not always if you have a busy beach downwind.... SO...SOLUTION... Get an Ozone bar, it flags out to one frontline, swivels anyways I think one of the good systems out there.

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Re: Wainman Hawaii 12m Boss - Safety System Help!?!?!

Postby Erlend M B » Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:37 pm

if conditions are hairy, I allways attach the leash to the flag line when I launch. I move it to suicide when I'm safe on the water.


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