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Titanium Foil

A forum dedicated to Hydrofoil riders


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DrLightWind
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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby DrLightWind » Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:29 pm

Hawaiis wrote:http://www.google.com.mx/patents/US20050266746
Mike Murphy basically cornered the aluminum market, that is why the rest started the carbon evolution.
I see :thumb:
And not only that, but he has a recent Pat 7980191 issued in 2011
"Extruded strut, fuselage and front wing assembly for towable hydrofoil."
So with the 2 patents and the combination of independent & dependent claims
for aluminum alloys virtually he rules and difficult to get around it in my opinion. :advise:

DrLW

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby tkettlepoint » Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:31 pm

to me it looks like just a US patent.... the rest of the world is free to do it the way I see it...
Most people that are building these foils don't live in the USA.

and if you dig deeper into it a guy in 1956 had a patent on something very close to it
http://www.google.com.mx/patents/US2815518

I would never want a alum mast anyways... I have one here and it is way too heavy , it would take your head off if you crash into it with a kite


Just my 2 cents
Terrie B

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Hawaiis
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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby Hawaiis » Sun Jan 05, 2014 12:15 am

tkettlepoint wrote:to me it looks like just a US patent.... the rest of the world is free to do it the way I see it...
Most people that are building these foils don't live in the USA.

and if you dig deeper into it a guy in 1956 had a patent on something very close to it
http://www.google.com.mx/patents/US2815518

I would never want a alum mast anyways... I have one here and it is way too heavy , it would take your head off if you crash into it with a kite


Just my 2 cents
Terrie B

Most civilized countries have patent treaties that respect each other's patent.

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby tkettlepoint » Sun Jan 05, 2014 2:02 am

most but not all... CHINA does not... they will copy anything for you... hell you can buy shit out the back door that is !00% copy but a different name on it.

A patent has be taken out in all countries. I have looked into it for a couple of things... It cost tons to get a international one. It is like a trade mark. same rules. Have a good friend that is a patent lawyer .

As long as it isn't 100% the same aka size shape it isn't a direct copy.. Look at the kite market. I know for sure if one company comes out with a great kite , the others are buying that kite and working off it in their design.

TerrieB

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby Laughingman » Sun Jan 05, 2014 2:19 am

tkettlepoint wrote:most but not all... CHINA does not... they will copy anything for you... hell you can buy shit out the back door that is !00% copy but a different name on it.

A patent has be taken out in all countries. I have looked into it for a couple of things... It cost tons to get a international one. It is like a trade mark. same rules. Have a good friend that is a patent lawyer .

As long as it isn't 100% the same aka size shape it isn't a direct copy.. Look at the kite market. I know for sure if one company comes out with a great kite , the others are buying that kite and working off it in their design.

TerrieB


Sure you can manufacture it but if the patent is held in say the USA the patent holder can block sales and shipments to the USA.... Take a look at samsung vs apple or example. Taking the USA out of your potential sales......

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby don pitcher » Sun Jan 05, 2014 4:31 pm

The patent looks lame. I suspect it is nothing more than a scare tactic for those who are not used to challenging a lame patent claim.

Here is someone other than Mike Murphy making an aluminum hydrofoil.

http://xairfoils.com/xone.htm

There are other companies that make aluminum wings for ski boat competition.

Aluminum towable hydrofoils have been around for at least four decades. Not much new.

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby don pitcher » Sun Jan 05, 2014 4:44 pm

tkettlepoint wrote:pete I have a alum one here if you wanted to check it out... it weighs a ton... I know I wouldn't want to get hit by it..

Terrie


From Hawaiis measurements, Carfino's carbon is not a bunch lighter than a solid aluminum foil.

MHL 3.7 kg
Carafino 4.35 kg
Rush Randle 5.5kg
MyWood 2.55 kg

viewtopic.php?f=196&t=2382338&start=39

If the aluminum was extruded, it would likely be lighter than the Carafino and cost much less.

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby tkettlepoint » Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:30 pm

I agree don about extruded would be lighter..

the x rush feels real real heavy in hand. to me it would feel like flinging a horse shoe at yourself And that is just the front wing. I will measure the rush x on a scale once I get some batteries for my scale and let you know how heavy this one is.

We'll see how mine comes out when I am done, I'm going the carbon and S glass route
Pressing the mast and body like we do for snowboards. and infusion most likely for the wings. Hell I might do everything in the press then it is heat cured. Just have to cut a couple of molds then I am good to go.

TerrieB
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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby swell » Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:13 am

Ok guys, thanx for the input. I'm just not sure if a 12mm solid aluminium is enough for the 1m mast...
Another option would be a cnc-cut wooden profile wraped with lets say 4mm aluminium tin.. would it be much lighter?

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Re: Titanium Foil

Postby Hawaiis » Mon Jan 06, 2014 11:54 am

12mm aluminum is on the weak side. you need to double the thickness.


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