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 Post subject: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:25 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 15, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 248
Location: Slovenia
What happens if you don`t have the money to buy a foil, and you also don`t have the time needed to properly build one? Well... the cheap, the bad, the ugly is born... Bellow you can see the pictures.
I have used what I had laying around, and build it in a couple of days/hours.

Construction:
- The mast is 90cm x 20cm, made from 5 layers of 3 mm poplar ply and covered in 4 layers of 300g glass on each side (2x90° and 2x45°). I tought it was rock solid when I tried to bend it with hands, but later (when fixed on board) found out it has quite some flex (longitudial and torsional).
- The fuselage is from 2 peaces of ALU 30 x 50 x 3mm, cca 70cm long.
- The wings are from 9,5mm leksan - flat plate with routed edges. Dimensions - front wing cca. 45 x 21cm and back wing cca. 25 x 12 cm. The wings have some flex, but my impression is they should be strong enough.
- The conection to the board is done trough transfer plate that mounts to the existing fin holes on my 2010 North LTD. The plate is from 3 layers of 3mm poplar ply and coverd in 3 layers of 300g glass each side. I have put many inserts in to be able to move the mast around if needed. The conection between mast and transfer plate is from ALU 30 x 50 x 3mm.

I know the creation is not something to be very proud of, but what you guys think - will it work for a beginner? I will let you know...

Any constructive criticism is more than welcome!

Greetings,
Jaros


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:38 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:51 pm
Posts: 75
Location: Florida
AWESOME! :lol:

Finally a foil that looks like I could build. I'm tired of seeing all these threads of "oh I'm building my first foil" and they break out the mad carbon fiber skills one could only dream of.

Definitely let us know how it works out. Good or bad!


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:26 am 
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Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:16 am
Posts: 328
Location: Chile/Brasil
wow that something diferent!
try to put Wood in the middle of the aluminum fuselaje.
i Would definetely make it stifer.


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:46 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 1:00 am
Posts: 29425
Location: World (KF Admin)
very cool!

let us know asap when you tested it! Curious if that worked! And a video as well!

Good luck :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 4:00 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:51 am
Posts: 16
I think it will work, but probably will not be very efficient. I have the following suggestions:

-Take a sander and add a proper foil the wings. It is important to have a thin trailing edge. The back wing should have a little negative lift (opposite of the front). The negative lift in the back helps you to reduce the angle of attack in the front by lifting the nose.

-If the wings have very much flex after sanding, consider laminating with fiberglass. Check that the resin will bond to the Lexan. You will definitely need to sand the entire surface.

-Thin out the trailing edge of the mast.

-Add a couple more layers of glass to the mast to reduce the flex.

-Try to get some lower profile bolts for the fuselage.

-If you don't already know how to ride a foil, it will be VERY difficult to troubleshoot mast placement, angle of attack, and overall lift. See if you can get an experienced foil rider to help you tune it.

Good luck and report back.


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:42 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:54 am
Posts: 77
Location: New Zealand
Thats bloody brilliant, you are my hero of the day :D

Something we all could make with little expense, sure it may not work as good as a carbon one but will cost way less and break open the price barrier to entry.

Especially like the plate to link to your race board,

I applaud you sir. :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 8:24 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:12 am
Posts: 22
Jaros,I see you are camping in Viganj?
what a great and windy place!
Have fun with hydro

aloha


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 8:48 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 15, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 248
Location: Slovenia
Quote:
aros,I see you are camping in Viganj?
what a great and windy place!
Have fun with hydro


Yes I am. I am not sure how were you able to pick that up from those photos though... :o
You must have great pair of eyes!
Greetings,
Jaros


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:06 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 15, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 248
Location: Slovenia
Quote:
I think it will work, but probably will not be very efficient. I have the following suggestions:
-Take a sander and add a proper foil the wings. It is important to have a thin trailing edge. The back wing should have a little negative lift (opposite of the front). The negative lift in the back helps you to reduce the angle of attack in the front by lifting the nose.
-If the wings have very much flex after sanding, consider laminating with fiberglass. Check that the resin will bond to the Lexan. You will definitely need to sand the entire surface.
-Thin out the trailing edge of the mast.
-Add a couple more layers of glass to the mast to reduce the flex.
-Try to get some lower profile bolts for the fuselage.
-If you don't already know how to ride a foil, it will be VERY difficult to troubleshoot mast placement, angle of attack, and overall lift. See if you can get an experienced foil rider to help you tune it.
Good luck and report back.


I know the proper foil shape would be great, but lexan is quite hard to work with. If you send it to fast it starts to melt. I routed the edge so the edge is thin, but i was limited with the router blade that I had at home, I am sure i could find something better in a tool store. To put a foil shape in the whole wing would not be very easy to do. If I will do that in the futute, I will rather do that in wood and glass it.
I also inversed the foil (if you can call the profile on my plank wing a foil...) on the back wing, so the front wing has a thin edge at the bottom and the back wing at the top. I am not sure if that will have any effect though...
I am planink to stiffen the mast in the future if I will see that this thing is worth upgrading, or maybe I will be forced to do something more sofisticated in the future. It would be wise if I would do the "weight and measure" test like suggested in this forum, to see where am I with the stiffnes compared to others. Mine sure does not wobble like the one on the Hawaiis video, so maybe it is not that bad.
Regarding the bolts - i was planning to route the bolts in and make everithing as flat as possible in the future - again if I will see this concept has some potencial. For now I just boltet everithing togather to see if it will work.
If I could get someone with experience to try out my creation would be great, but I do not beleive I will have the luck to find one arround here. I only saw two folers in the last cuple of years. And most probably I would be too ashamed to show this "beauty" to someone used to fly on high tech carbon wing...

Thank you all for your thoughts, and keep them comming! :thumb:

Greetings,
Jaros


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 Post subject: Re: the cheap, the bad, the ugly
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:15 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:15 am
Posts: 1473
Awesome ... acrylic wings are a great idea, i like it all....

this one cost me around $110 nz to make.
Attachment:
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It did work for a short time but needs
1. a solid or greater wall thickness for strut as base of mast (it bent)
2. wings bolted to base, not top
3. mast need wrapping in some triax glass (screw carbon too expensive..) to stiffen it up (its an ally cross section you can buy off the shelf but wall thickenss lacking a bit)

My plan was to make a make vid like my $22 wakeskate one a few years ago (http://vimeo.com/24164501 ) and get it all tested and working but i moved to australia and had to leave it behind.

Plans for an open source raceboard too. The current foil and race scene is all good for those with sponsorship or wealth and good for them, but does nothing to help develop youth kiting in these areas where the number one barrier is simply cost of equipment due to it being an arms race like formula one, where results are biased on equipment used /afforded, so if you dont have the cash , why bother. Anyway, good to see innovation..


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