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its not going to happen for me

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Arcsrule
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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby Arcsrule » Thu Mar 02, 2017 11:46 am

yea...it's a slingshot not LF...losing my mind! I feel that I can chop the mast to 20 inches, I will be able to walk out to a better position where I can body drag. This shortened foil will be for learning only, and if I learn I will buy a new lighter foil. I had pics of my foil build when I lost my hard drive a couple weeks back but nothing now. I am most certain that the bolts I used to attach the wings will not hold and both wings will be epoxied on permanent. getting the right pitch on the rear wing will be a problem for sure.

Arcsrule
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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby Arcsrule » Thu Mar 02, 2017 11:52 am

there are no hydro foils within 4 hours of me so it will be next to impossible to observe one. I have been flying foil kites since 2000 and have always been an 'outsider 'in my area. Foil kites are still unheard of in North Florida so you can imagine the difficulty finding Hydrofoil guys.

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Starsky
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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby Starsky » Thu Mar 02, 2017 12:28 pm

Why would you choose to take a loss on the Slingshot set up you have without getting any of the benefit of the fact that its in your hands? It's going to sell for nominally less with a bit of use, and that may well be the best money you spend. You already own it, USE it.

You have all the short masts. Disregard your home build until you get your foil face on. You don't even know if it's suitable to learn on and trying to figure that out while on the learning curve won't be easier than simply using the Slingshot. Everyone who uses it says it starts flying at nice slow speeds, has a nice moderate top end and is smooth and stable everywhere in between.

Trust your first instincts. Why else did you buy it? Watch their vids... which Im sure you already have, and get off the mental gymnastics and onto the learning curve.

You might find you like the slingshot as much as you did arcs. Forget about weight! Makes no difference to the learning curve or even free riding enjoyment. Once you can ride, you can play around with your home build to your hearts content, but cutting the one key piece in half is just going to destroy any potential it has. Selling the slingshot unused to recoup some cash and trying to learn on a cut down, untested/tuned version of your home build is a really weird way to try and make it easy on yourself.

You cut that carbon build down, you will be joining the likes of airbunny when it comes to advice from the forum. Not a single reply has agreed that its a good idea to cut your carbon.

Arcsrule
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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby Arcsrule » Thu Mar 02, 2017 7:29 pm

ok. :)

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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby Kamikuza » Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:41 am

You can body drag in a depth of water almost the width of the board. Hold the board right on its side, like a TT, and go like that. The mast will be parallel to the surface of the water.

When you're beginning, you want enough wind/kite to be able to just body drag easily. If you can't body drag, you most likely can't ride. At all.

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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby KYLakeKiter » Fri Mar 03, 2017 4:42 am

Is it just me, or does the short mast seem like a crutch that only helps half the problem? I get why it might help learn to plane a little quicker because the drop when the foil busts the surface is less making you less likely to fall. Conversely, a longer mast gives you more time to react as you come up on plane hopefully giving you a little more time to get your stuff together before the foil busts the surface, again, hopefully giving you a slightly better chance to continue to ride on plane. I'm sure it is different for every individual based on their previous experience and riding style, but I'm not completely convinced the short mast is the magic bullet it is billed as.

To quantify my opinion, I am a beginner foiler who can ride on plane both directions, but still working on jybes on plane (occasionally I pull one off, but I usually drop the board on the water during my turns). I only used a full size mast to learn on, and learned towed before I started using a kite. I think the ability to drop off plane from full height without falling was a helpful skill to develop.

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Kamikuza
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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby Kamikuza » Fri Mar 03, 2017 10:47 am

That's my thoughts on short masts too.

Rode a 600mm at the estuary for the first time (on a short mast) and didn't like it--was great not to keep grounding out, but was more difficult to keep the board off the water, especially when doing transitions.

I guess though that the converse is true--you learn good (and subconscious!) height control...I must let mine wander up and down a lot.

More than one path though, whatever works.

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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby TomW » Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:25 pm

This discussion will never end!
As Starsky said: if you've learned on short struts, you're probably convinced it was helpful or an imperative.
If you learned on full size strut, you think it's not necessary.

What we'd have to have is quantitative data on " hours to learn to fly 100 m in each direction without touching down, be able to do that with controlled stop, using a full-size strut "
With and without using shorter struts.

Now I just learned on full sized strut, was able to pass the test on 5th session ( 6th hour). I cannot see how using a shorter strut would have made it faster to learn.
Bear in mind I was CONVINCED that I need a shorter strut at 3Rd hour.
But I did have private, radio based instruction in near perfect conditions ( wind was light and gusting) for hours 4-5-6-7.
So I'm convinced that professional instruction with radio accelerates learning :wink:

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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby junebug » Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:36 pm

I used a short mast because the first time I tried foiling, which was on a regular sized mast, I almost broke my leg when I lost balance leaning too far backward and the mast came flying up out of the water and smacked my shin. Whether the short mast actually helped or not I can't say, but I am convinced it is much safer, particularly for people like me who had only ridden TTs before foiling. It was expensive, insofar as I rode the 15 inch mast for only like 1 day and then the 24 inch mast for only a couple of days before graduating to the full sized mast, but it was a lot less expensive than a trip to the ER.

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Re: its not going to happen for me

Postby plummet » Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:50 pm

I too learning on a long mast. well 90cm, I see the advantage of a shorter masts for the first 10 or 15 hours. But really in my opinion they are a gratuitous waist of money. You might accelerate your learning by 3-4 hours.
So what.
if you have the option to borrow shorter masts then that would be ideal.


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