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toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

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max
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toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby max » Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:01 pm

the toeside 180 tack looks a cool move when done by a few of the free ride masters . . . does anyone who can do it or is trying it have any advice for someone who is building up to giving it a go . . . something more than just give it a go?

junebug
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby junebug » Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:06 pm

Run a search for 180, 360, and tacks. There are great tips on other threads.

Here's a good place to start: viewtopic.php?f=196&t=2396962

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Starsky
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby Starsky » Sat Aug 26, 2017 3:08 pm

The smaller the kite the quicker you have to do it. A med to large kite is easier to learn on. Foil kites make it look almost slo mo.

You need decent speed. I generally accelerate a little in prep so I have good speed and am feathering the power with the bar out a bit.

Drift the kite high as you begin to point further upwind.

As it approaches zenith and before you lose speed, carve upwind with the express intent on going right through straight upwind quickly (I was stalling dead upwind for the first little while).

Keep your head up and looking over your lead shoulder past upwind toward the direction you want to go. Keep your body and the foil relatively vertical. There is a point where you have to go from heel side across the board to toe side and its much easier to do this with everything vertical. It helps to drive the 180 as more of a rotation driven by your hips and lower body as apposed to a hard carve initiated by banking the foil over. Sheet in as the board passes through upwind and the kite crosses the zenith. This will take a lot of your weight and let the foil keep flying as the speed drops. As your weight shifts across the centre line of the board from heel to toe, dive the kite onto the new tack while continuing to drive the board through the rotation with your feet. With smaller kites it will often loop. Nice because you exit without twisted lines.

Pitfalls:

Not having enough speed.

Leaning back too hard and canting the foil over to initiating the carve...... usually leads to falling off the tail.

Stalling the rotation with the board dead upwind. Like a lot of moves, I started learning this one with my head really only planning the first half. Most moves you kinda start that way, until you get some confidence as to how the move will feel.

I began to get it more consistently whey I started to really lead with my head. Keeping eyes up and looking over my shoulder onto the new tack while driving the rotation with my feet past the halfway mark.

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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby dylan* » Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:56 pm

Starsky wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 3:08 pm
things
any advice for what i might be doing wrong if i am getting pulled off in the direction i was originally travelling, even if my kite is at 12:00 or moving toward the new direction? i've landed a few roll tacks with a foot change but i still fall like this most of the time and can't figure out exactly what's wrong

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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby Peter_Frank » Sat Aug 26, 2017 5:39 pm

dylan* wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:56 pm
Starsky wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 3:08 pm
things
any advice for what i might be doing wrong if i am getting pulled off in the direction i was originally travelling, even if my kite is at 12:00 or moving toward the new direction? i've landed a few roll tacks with a foot change but i still fall like this most of the time and can't figure out exactly what's wrong

Dylan, for both 180s and roll tacks, what you experience is what we all do wrong at first - so we ride "on" in our original direction and crash :roll:

The trick is simply to move the kite a lot further in the new direction, before tacking, that is all there is to it, believe me, it makes a HUGE difference :thumb:

With a bigger foil kite it is much easier, as they give you much more hangtime thus time, with balloons you have less time, but the principle is still the same - move the kite FAR over before going around (same thing with 360s btw), and you wont continue in your original path anymore - try it !

8) PF

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cglazier
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby cglazier » Sat Aug 26, 2017 6:52 pm

For me it helped to approach it as just a weak backroll.. where you don't put in enough energy (jump) to leave the water or to rotate all the way around.

:wink: CG
Last edited by cglazier on Sat Aug 26, 2017 7:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

juandesooka
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby juandesooka » Sat Aug 26, 2017 6:53 pm

this is a move I hope to conquer before end of summer wind season, but have been unable to get my head around it, seems so foreign, "where do the lines go?"

I rigged up my 2m trainer kite last week and walked through it on land. So weird! I crashed the kite several times before figuring out the rotation. Kind of like backrolls in its mechanics. Key for me was to keep both hands on the bar and focus on not turning the bar at all as I duck around the lines, as I inevitably pulled the wrong way. Heel to toe was a lot easier than toe to heel.

I think I am ready to try it on the water, though I am sure the first few times will be a s**t show. I am probably overthinking it, but my fear is falling backwards and towards foil, with kite looping.....seems like potential for carnage.

Anyhoo.....point being that the land training seemed to help, if you have a mental block like me. Rig up a small kite and practice your dance moves.

max
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby max » Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:13 pm

Starsky wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 3:08 pm

You need decent speed. I generally accelerate a little in prep so I have good speed and am feathering the power with the bar out a bit.

Drift the kite high as you begin to point further upwind.

As it approaches zenith and before you lose speed, carve upwind with the express intent on going right through straight upwind quickly (I was stalling dead upwind for the first little while).

Keep your head up and looking over your lead shoulder past upwind toward the direction you want to go. Keep your body and the foil relatively vertical. There is a point where you have to go from heel side across the board to toe side and its much easier to do this with everything vertical. It helps to drive the 180 as more of a rotation driven by your hips and lower body as apposed to a hard carve initiated by banking the foil over. Sheet in as the board passes through upwind and the kite crosses the zenith. This will take a lot of your weight and let the foil keep flying as the speed drops. As your weight shifts across the centre line of the board from heel to toe, dive the kite onto the new tack while continuing to drive the board through the rotation with your feet. With smaller kites it will often loop. Nice because you exit without twisted lines.

hi Starsky . . . awesome description but are you referring to the heel to toe-side 180 tack?

I was after the toe-side to heel-side 180 tack where you go into the move from toe-side. Maybe your description still applies if we swap …. across the centre line of the board from heel to toe … to across the centre line of the board from toe to heel?

Hope I have not misunderstood.

max
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby max » Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:18 pm

juandesooka wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 6:53 pm
this is a move I hope to conquer before end of summer wind season, but have been unable to get my head around it, seems so foreign, "where do the lines go?"

I rigged up my 2m trainer kite last week and walked through it on land. So weird! I crashed the kite several times before figuring out the rotation. Kind of like backrolls in its mechanics. Key for me was to keep both hands on the bar and focus on not turning the bar at all as I duck around the lines, as I inevitably pulled the wrong way. Heel to toe was a lot easier than toe to heel.

I think I am ready to try it on the water, though I am sure the first few times will be a s**t show. I am probably overthinking it, but my fear is falling backwards and towards foil, with kite looping.....seems like potential for carnage.

Anyhoo.....point being that the land training seemed to help, if you have a mental block like me. Rig up a small kite and practice your dance moves.
What you described is what is going through my mind also.

Almost gave it a go yesterday but the wind was quite strong and my mind was more focused on the potential carnage as you describe than on the task at hand.

I think I also need to go through the dance move process either on land or on a surface riding board for the first few attempts.

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Starsky
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Re: toeside 180 tack . . . anyone got advice

Postby Starsky » Sat Aug 26, 2017 11:13 pm

max wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:13 pm

hi Starsky . . . awesome description but are you referring to the heel to toe-side 180 tack?

I was after the toe-side to heel-side 180 tack where you go into the move from toe-side. Maybe your description still applies if we swap …. across the centre line of the board from heel to toe … to across the centre line of the board from toe to heel?

Hope I have not misunderstood.
Oops!

Your totally right.

Haven't even tried a toe to heel 180 yet.

Sorry for the mislead.


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