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Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

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neilhapgood
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Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby neilhapgood » Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:06 pm

Hi all,

In my bigger kites I currently have a 2015 12m blade skinny boy which is their wave kite and a 2013 10m north dyno.

I find with the 12m I seem to get overpowered really quickly in that pulling you onto your toes kind of way, especially as I accelerate and the apparent builds, where as the dyno seems to depower better and as you go faster it doesn't seem to get so overpowered but keep delivering smooth power.

Seeing how I like the dyno I am wondering if I should sell the blade and get a second hand 13m dyno (they don't make a 12m)'
OR is the issue simply the nature of different kite sizes and a 12m on a foil will always be a bit of a hanful as you accelerate?! In which case getting a 13m dyno might be worse as its bigger again!

Any thoughts would be appreciated

Many thanks in advance

jaros
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby jaros » Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:39 pm

Hi,
I am 75 kg, and I did not use my 12m2 kite not once in the whole season. When it is 8-9knots I am already using the 9m2. I have different kites than you (strutless Storm Voyager), but I also feel like I am overpowered on the 12 almost always. I am not racing, but freeriding and carving, so I like my kite as small as possible for the given wind. Last year my most used kite was 9m2, this year it is the 7m2, the wind being the same...
Greetings,
Jaros

juandesooka
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby juandesooka » Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:36 pm

You didn't say how windy it is, but I'd bet the issue is just that you don't need a 12m any more in that wind range. You can easily expe to drop one size (2m) from normal, possibly more.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby Peter_Frank » Sun Aug 27, 2017 10:47 pm

You are average weight (75 kg), and you dont race, so it is pretty normal that most 12 m2 kites will have you getting "too much" really quick, meaning when you ride toeside you accelerate too much and no fun :(

They are still fine for really light wind though, especially if you got a "ligther" 12 m2 - but it is still a kite that you want to "rig down" from as soon as possible, to a 9 or 10 m2 which is way more fun, but needs a tad more wind.

Some kites can depower more than others, but in my friends and my experience, it is still the same, a good 12 m2 is great if too light wind - but you try to avoid this size if you can (but often you cant, if only 7 knots of wind)

The Dyno is higher AR and dont sit too deep, thus easier to control - but if you get a bigger Dyno, you will experience the same negatives as most kites around 12 m2, is my prediction.

I had a 13 m2 Dyno, sold it because of this, and got a faster turning one strut 12 that could depower a lot and it works so much better - but as said, you NEED this size in 7-8 knots of wind, eventhough you would rather ride a 10 m2 in 9 knots whenever possible, but on beautiful summerdays it often stays under 9 here, and most likely in many other spots with weaker but smooth seabreezes.

8) PF

dylan*
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby dylan* » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:22 am

I am 65kg and I always find that big kites always have the smallest wind range. I can only ride a 17m comfortably with a twintip up to 12-13 knots, and then with a foil a 12m is a "big" kite and I can only ride that up to 13-14 knots before the fun factor goes down. On a twintip my 12m has a huge range, and on a foil my 10m seems to have a huge range, although I admit I haven't explored its top end too much as I would rather ride another board once the wind is stronger than 15 kts.

Everyone's individual numbers will vary by location (a 9m will not even fly here in 8-9 kts as claimed above) so adjust accordingly but it sounds like you should just ride a smaller kite.

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davesails7
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby davesails7 » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:04 pm

neilhapgood wrote:
Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:06 pm
the dyno seems to depower better and as you go faster it doesn't seem to get so overpowered but keep delivering smooth power.
Ive found that is the benefit of the higher aspect race kites. When you carry more power and load it up, it just flies further forward in the window and pulls you more upwind. When you load up a lower aspect kite it just sits back and pulls. The race foil kites are even better when loaded up.

If you want to go fast or race, I think the higher aspect kite is a real benefit. If your goal is to rig as small a kite as possible, as most people want, then you wont really get a benefit from a bigger high aspect race kite.

When I was learning to foil, with an intent to race, I got 10m and 13m ozone edges (similar to dyno). As a beginner I almost always wanted the 10m, but as I got better I started liking the additional power of the 13m in light winds. Then got a 15m chrono instead and never went back to inflatables.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:56 pm

davesails7 wrote:
Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:04 pm
neilhapgood wrote:
Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:06 pm
the dyno seems to depower better and as you go faster it doesn't seem to get so overpowered but keep delivering smooth power.
Ive found that is the benefit of the higher aspect race kites. When you carry more power and load it up, it just flies further forward in the window and pulls you more upwind. When you load up a lower aspect kite it just sits back and pulls. The race foil kites are even better when loaded up.

If you want to go fast or race, I think the higher aspect kite is a real benefit. If your goal is to rig as small a kite as possible, as most people want, then you wont really get a benefit from a bigger high aspect race kite.

When I was learning to foil, with an intent to race, I got 10m and 13m ozone edges (similar to dyno). As a beginner I almost always wanted the 10m, but as I got better I started liking the additional power of the 13m in light winds. Then got a 15m chrono instead and never went back to inflatables.

"If you want to go fast or race, I think the higher aspect kite is a real benefit. If your goal is to rig as small a kite as possible, as most people want, then you wont really get a benefit from a bigger high aspect race kite."

Hmmm, agree that a BIGGER high aspect race kite, not for freeride at all, no.

But for using small kites for freeride, a higher aspect race kite (or just higher aspect) can make you go even smaller, as more power on demand.

Some might prefer the lazy fat kites, yes, if they got sufficient depower that is.

So very individual what one prefers :naughty:

8) PF

TomW
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby TomW » Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:36 pm

I'm thinking about replacing my North Mono 12 with a Ozone hyperlink 12. I'll keep my Mono 9 & 7. I use my Mono 12 a lot, but also want to get more out of higher end without the flapping. They say the hyperlink depowers without losing shape or stability, giving it incredible high end.

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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby borist » Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:26 am

TomW wrote:
Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:36 pm
I'm thinking about replacing my North Mono 12 with a Ozone hyperlink 12. I'll keep my Mono 9 & 7. I use my Mono 12 a lot, but also want to get more out of higher end without the flapping. They say the hyperlink depowers without losing shape or stability, giving it incredible high end.
I'd not go too far with "incredible range" claim when used for freeride HF. It is a lovely kite and does depower well, but I found it a bit too much during jibes when powered up, say around 13 knots plus, especially when gusty. Often find myself pulling hard on brake line to tighten the loop to keep the power spike to minimum.
With TT or SB, sure

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Kite quandary, any input appreciated!

Postby Peter_Frank » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:01 am

No wonder you are powered up with a 12 (assume we are talking 12s), I use 7 or 8 m2 in +13 knots, and am NOT lightly powered @78 kg :lol:

Racewing or jumping ?

8) PF


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