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Moses 2018

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Moses 2018

Postby Peter_Frank » Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:45 pm

Anyways, I find it great that Moses got such a big range of wings :thumb:

8) PF

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Re: Moses 2018

Postby Frank Rosin » Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:09 pm

grigorib wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 2:21 pm

Give race foils to racers and freeride foils to freeriders.
These two classes don’t mix. They don’t even overlap, neither in kites, nor in boards, nor in foil wings.

This class separation is beautiful.

I think race gear can be great for freeriding too.
For example loving the Moses race wings for quite different riding styles!
And in some conditions I may even consider racing the Ozone Hyperlink :)

Cheers,
Frank
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Last edited by Frank Rosin on Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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gmb13
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Re: Moses 2018

Postby gmb13 » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:22 pm

Pedro Marcos wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:18 pm
gmb13 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:06 pm
Pedro Marcos wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:51 pm


I dont agree that the 633 is anywhere close the 550 or any other moses freeride wing, in terms of aceleration its like comparing a fiat punto with a ferrari. The 633 at 40kph feels sooo heavy under you and seems its going to explode, where the 550 feels light and performing.
To each their own. Having said that. It is by far the best wing for people to progress on. Even good riders will find it easier to learn new things on the 633. I have learned a lot of new things since I started riding the 633. Most people will never be able to foiling tack on a smaller wings, whereas on the 633 they can easily learn it. Another thing I have to say is, it needs to be mounted quite far back towards the tail of the board. about 15-18cm from the tail to the screws. If you are riding it in the same place as the 590 or 550, then you are not getting the most out of the wing.

--
Gunnar
Meaning you hardly can ride with it with straps on a Moses t40 or t60 board, like i said before. Ive used it all far back on a board with tracks. Regarding the Foiling tack, its just so different, im able to do foil tacks in race wings and had to "re-learn" it to be able to do on the 633, the foot switch at such low speed its quite tricky and this wing its quite roll nervous, if you are talking about the 180 tack to toeside then yes, way much easier.

Also the new 2018 race wing need to be mounted way more back then the "old" one, so it might also feel very weird on a T60 board even with the straps on the most forward position.
Are you using it on a the 71cm mast, or on the same mast as your race foil? If you are using it on the 71 I can follow what you are saying, but on the 91cm mast, the 633 is the easiest wing I have ever done tacks with. You can almost completely balls it up, and still foil through the tacks. If you are saying the 633 is less roll stable than a race foil, then yours must be broken.

--
Gunnar
Last edited by gmb13 on Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Moses 2018

Postby gmb13 » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:31 pm

grigorib wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 2:21 pm
airsurfer wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 12:07 am
...
super stable foil. BTW I think the 633 deserves it's own thread

Give race foils to racers and freeride foils to freeriders.
These two classes don’t mix. They don’t even overlap, neither in kites, nor in boards, nor in foil wings.

This class separation is beautiful.
That is exactly right.

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Re: Moses 2018

Postby Pedro Marcos » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:04 am

gmb13 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:22 pm
Pedro Marcos wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:18 pm
gmb13 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:06 pm


To each their own. Having said that. It is by far the best wing for people to progress on. Even good riders will find it easier to learn new things on the 633. I have learned a lot of new things since I started riding the 633. Most people will never be able to foiling tack on a smaller wings, whereas on the 633 they can easily learn it. Another thing I have to say is, it needs to be mounted quite far back towards the tail of the board. about 15-18cm from the tail to the screws. If you are riding it in the same place as the 590 or 550, then you are not getting the most out of the wing.

--
Gunnar
Meaning you hardly can ride with it with straps on a Moses t40 or t60 board, like i said before. Ive used it all far back on a board with tracks. Regarding the Foiling tack, its just so different, im able to do foil tacks in race wings and had to "re-learn" it to be able to do on the 633, the foot switch at such low speed its quite tricky and this wing its quite roll nervous, if you are talking about the 180 tack to toeside then yes, way much easier.

Also the new 2018 race wing need to be mounted way more back then the "old" one, so it might also feel very weird on a T60 board even with the straps on the most forward position.
Are you using it on a the 71cm mast, or on the same mast as your race foil? If you are using it on the 71 I can follow what you are saying, but on the 91cm mast, the 633 is the easiest wing I have ever done tacks with. You can almost completely balls it up, and still foil through the tacks. If you are saying the 633 is less roll stable than a race foil, then yours must be broken.

--
Gunnar
Using the 633 on 91 mast, race foil on 111 mast. I compare the roll stability of the 633 to the 2017 Fluente (325 sta). On the race foil i can approach the tacks with much higher speed which makes things easier (because ive learned it this way, maybe), for me the slower i approach the maneuver the less stability i have.

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Re: Moses 2018

Postby gmb13 » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:40 am

Pedro Marcos wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:04 am
gmb13 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:22 pm
Pedro Marcos wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:18 pm


Meaning you hardly can ride with it with straps on a Moses t40 or t60 board, like i said before. Ive used it all far back on a board with tracks. Regarding the Foiling tack, its just so different, im able to do foil tacks in race wings and had to "re-learn" it to be able to do on the 633, the foot switch at such low speed its quite tricky and this wing its quite roll nervous, if you are talking about the 180 tack to toeside then yes, way much easier.

Also the new 2018 race wing need to be mounted way more back then the "old" one, so it might also feel very weird on a T60 board even with the straps on the most forward position.
Are you using it on a the 71cm mast, or on the same mast as your race foil? If you are using it on the 71 I can follow what you are saying, but on the 91cm mast, the 633 is the easiest wing I have ever done tacks with. You can almost completely balls it up, and still foil through the tacks. If you are saying the 633 is less roll stable than a race foil, then yours must be broken.

--
Gunnar
Using the 633 on 91 mast, race foil on 111 mast. I compare the roll stability of the 633 to the 2017 Fluente (325 sta). On the race foil i can approach the tacks with much higher speed which makes things easier (because ive learned it this way, maybe), for me the slower i approach the maneuver the less stability i have.
That still makes very little sense. You can do the tack on the 633 when going slow and it will be more stable than the Fluente at the same speed. This is what makes it easy to learn to tack, or gybe for that matter, especially in light winds. The 633 (with S483 is super roll stable.

--
Gunnar

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Pedro Marcos
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Re: Moses 2018

Postby Pedro Marcos » Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:07 am

gmb13 wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:40 am
Pedro Marcos wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:04 am
gmb13 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:22 pm


Are you using it on a the 71cm mast, or on the same mast as your race foil? If you are using it on the 71 I can follow what you are saying, but on the 91cm mast, the 633 is the easiest wing I have ever done tacks with. You can almost completely balls it up, and still foil through the tacks. If you are saying the 633 is less roll stable than a race foil, then yours must be broken.

--
Gunnar
Using the 633 on 91 mast, race foil on 111 mast. I compare the roll stability of the 633 to the 2017 Fluente (325 sta). On the race foil i can approach the tacks with much higher speed which makes things easier (because ive learned it this way, maybe), for me the slower i approach the maneuver the less stability i have.
That still makes very little sense. You can do the tack on the 633 when going slow and it will be more stable than the Fluente at the same speed. This is what makes it easy to learn to tack, or gybe for that matter, especially in light winds. The 633 (with S483 is super roll stable.

--
Gunnar
Well to try to do it on the Fluente with the same speed would be almost impossible for me, and would most likely stall it, as the speed is quite low, i need more speed/glide for that. It seems you are riding the 633 much faster then me, its the only explanation i can find for your comments, next session ill put the mast in the most back position (which in my board is 20cm from the tail) and the straps in the most forward to try to go faster on it and see if there is a different feeling.

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Re: Moses 2018

Postby TomW » Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:15 pm

Wish I had the euros you'll buy all this stuff.....budget blown to hell after getting the 590 and a Hyperlink 9m....

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Pedro Marcos
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Re: Moses 2018

Postby Pedro Marcos » Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:44 pm

TomW wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:15 pm
Wish I had the euros you'll buy all this stuff.....budget blown to hell after getting the 590 and a Hyperlink 9m....
Got almost everything second hand, helps abit :)

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Re: Moses 2018

Postby skideeppow » Tue Mar 27, 2018 7:42 pm

So i was in El Cuyo mex last week. Riding my Ghost WHisperer with a 545 wing. It was super choppy and large swell. I could not foil. It was like i was learning all over again.
So question, i was about to pull the trigger on the moses 548 front wing. But from reading here, everyone seems to dig that 633. Is the surface area that much different? is the 545 and the 548 too close in size to have both?


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