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Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

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windrider1
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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby windrider1 » Mon Feb 15, 2016 5:52 am

The lines are not the problem. The bar im using is a new bar i got with a lotus i just bought a few weeks ago and it flys perfectly with the lotus no problems.As u can See the mixer lines were off a little bit and so I adjusted them and as soon as i get some steady wind ill test the kite out again in a few days.



DvB wrote:Windrider1, you don't need wind to check your line lengths, test them with your lines detached from the kite and tied off to a single fixed point. With the depower strap set to full power and the bar pulled all the way in, all four lines should be the same length, with equal tension on all 4. This should be done on a regular basis, as the front lines experience far greater tension than the steering lines.

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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby Adventure Logs » Mon Feb 15, 2016 5:08 pm

Jzh_perth wrote:I've also got the new Speed 5 12m. I've only had a chance to fly it once but it was 100% in my opinion. I've been on Sonic's for 12 months or so, so perhaps the higher AR from the 4 to 5 is less noticeable for me. From what you describe (trimmer pulled all the way in) it sounds like your rear lines are shorter than the fronts when fully sheeted in.

Love to get your comparison with the Sonic. Which one turns faster?

=J-

sparkin_larkin
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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby sparkin_larkin » Wed Feb 17, 2016 1:08 am

Love to get your comparison with the Sonic. Which one turns faster?
So would I please tell us! User friendly and all that and don't spare us the details.

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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby Jzh_perth » Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:51 am

We've got club racing on Sunday so with weather permitting, I'll try and ride Sonic 11 back to back with Speed 5 12 on the foil board and let you know.

:)

windrider1
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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby windrider1 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:23 am

Ok I finally had a chance to take the kite out to check it out. Unfortunately the kite still stalled with all the knots matching on the mixer test . Bear in mind I have 3 speed 4 kites and dont have this problem . Like I stated before with the trimmer pulled in all the way and depowered the kite is ok but when I try to power up the kite by pulling in the bar it starts to stall note (my bar lines are not the problem they are all equal ). I then adjusted the b and c lines on the mixer by moving the knots on the ring on the pulley line to make them a little longer and this helped a little bit but still stalling . I then decided to put up my 10m speed 4 and look at the bridles even though they have a different bridle set up I noticed that the brake lines or z lines looked a lot looser in flight and when powered up than the speed 5 so I then took apart the z bridle on the speed 5 and added a 4 inch pigtail. and boom a totally different kite. moves smoothly through the sky no stalling when bar pulled in and powered up . so there u go I don't know if this was just limited to my kite only but thankfully now the kite flies without any problems.

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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby foilholio » Thu Feb 18, 2016 2:22 am

When you lengthen BC it has the effect of tightening Z. If you had done the opposite shortened BC it's the same as lengthening Z. Only difference is FS mixers limit or sit right on the limit of releasing B when depowered, so if you use the mixer to shorten B to correct the profile it will also lessen the depower.

Unusual that lengthening Z will reduce stall. A tighter Z usually has less stall, but if it is way too tight it could be messing the profile a lot and the kite wont fly well at all.

Sad to see a new kite from FS with a problem like this. I wonder if wrong bridle/s have been installed somewhere. Sounds like the problem is with Z and your solution was correct, maybe it is just the Z mains running from the mixer that have the wrong length.

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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby windrider1 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:01 am

Are you sure lengthening B and C shortens Z that's not wht I noticed .when I say I lengthened B and C I meant I adjusted the ring on the pulley line by making the loop smaller . and by the way just to clarify I actually took apart the bridle lines that attach to Z which are some thin lines that connect to the trailing edge of the kite and put a pigtail on to that then connected everything back up together with the z line. My conclusion is tht the bridle lines from the trailing edge of the kite to Z main are a little too tight and need about a 4 inch pigtail and also the B and C mains could use an extra 1 1/2 inches of added adjustment and the kite loosens up and flies right.


windrider1 wrote:Ok I finally had a chance to take the kite out to check it out. Unfortunately the kite still stalled with all the knots matching on the mixer test . Bear in mind I have 3 speed 4 kites and dont have this problem . Like I stated before with the trimmer pulled in all the way and depowered the kite is ok but when I try to power up the kite by pulling in the bar it starts to stall note (my bar lines are not the problem they are all equal ). I then adjusted the b and c lines on the mixer by moving the knots on the ring on the pulley line to make them a little longer and this helped a little bit but still stalling . I then decided to put up my 10m speed 4 and look at the bridles even though they have a different bridle set up I noticed that the brake lines or z lines looked a lot looser in flight and when powered up than the speed 5 so I then took apart the z bridle on the speed 5 and added a 4 inch pigtail. and boom a totally different kite. moves smoothly through the sky no stalling when bar pulled in and powered up . so there u go I don't know if this was just limited to my kite only but thankfully now the kite flies without any problems.
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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby Adventure Logs » Thu Feb 18, 2016 4:12 am

windrider1 wrote:Ok I finally had a chance to take the kite out to check it out. Unfortunately the kite still stalled with all the knots matching on the mixer test . Bear in mind I have 3 speed 4 kites and dont have this problem . Like I stated before with the trimmer pulled in all the way and depowered the kite is ok but when I try to power up the kite by pulling in the bar it starts to stall note (my bar lines are not the problem they are all equal ). I then adjusted the b and c lines on the mixer by moving the knots on the ring on the pulley line to make them a little longer and this helped a little bit but still stalling . I then decided to put up my 10m speed 4 and look at the bridles even though they have a different bridle set up I noticed that the brake lines or z lines looked a lot looser in flight and when powered up than the speed 5 so I then took apart the z bridle on the speed 5 and added a 4 inch pigtail. and boom a totally different kite. moves smoothly through the sky no stalling when bar pulled in and powered up . so there u go I don't know if this was just limited to my kite only but thankfully now the kite flies without any problems.
Honestly with this many problems with a brand new kite I would contact your dealer and lemon it out with the warranty. Having to add pigtails, etc, on something brand new is not how I would want to start.

=J-

windrider1
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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby windrider1 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 9:16 am

Unfortunately I wanted to be one of the first to get the kite and ordered it from another country, it would be too costly to send it back. I used some spare line they included with the kite so the mod is not really noticeable anywyas. I'm just happy every thing is fine now and hope no one else encounter similar issues.
logsdon wrote:
windrider1 wrote:Ok I finally had a chance to take the kite out to check it out. Unfortunately the kite still stalled with all the knots matching on the mixer test . Bear in mind I have 3 speed 4 kites and dont have this problem . Like I stated before with the trimmer pulled in all the way and depowered the kite is ok but when I try to power up the kite by pulling in the bar it starts to stall note (my bar lines are not the problem they are all equal ). I then adjusted the b and c lines on the mixer by moving the knots on the ring on the pulley line to make them a little longer and this helped a little bit but still stalling . I then decided to put up my 10m speed 4 and look at the bridles even though they have a different bridle set up I noticed that the brake lines or z lines looked a lot looser in flight and when powered up than the speed 5 so I then took apart the z bridle on the speed 5 and added a 4 inch pigtail. and boom a totally different kite. moves smoothly through the sky no stalling when bar pulled in and powered up . so there u go I don't know if this was just limited to my kite only but thankfully now the kite flies without any problems.
Honestly with this many problems with a brand new kite I would contact your dealer and lemon it out with the warranty. Having to add pigtails, etc, on something brand new is not how I would want to start.

=J-

foilholio
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Re: Flysurfer Speed 5 vs speed 4 and backstall.

Postby foilholio » Thu Feb 18, 2016 9:40 am

windrider1 wrote: Are you sure lengthening B and C shortens Z
Yes I am, but "technically" it doesn't as you haven't changed the length of Z. The mixer works on a principal of ratios or proportions. You lengthen one it's the same as had you shortened all the others. Adjusting Z itself is actually a great way to adjust the kites. This is because Z shrinks the most, B and C stay much in the correct ratios and the final AB or depower remains constant.


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