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How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

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Topaz
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How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby Topaz » Sat Aug 27, 2016 6:00 pm

How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites? Will a 15m Flysurfer Speed4 feel more like a 16 or 17 inflatable? Or it will have about the same power than a Contra 15m, for instance?

I’m learning to foil with a Cabrinha Double Agent and a Naish Torch 12m. At this point, I can foil up and down wind kind of decently, and I’m about to start practicing tacking and jibing. The 12m Torch gets me going at solid 11 knots. I’m thinking in getting a Flysurfer Speed3 or Speed4, or an Ozone Chrono V2 , but I’m not sure whether to get a 12m or a 15m. I weight 145lbs and I’m in South Florida. I’d like to be able to ride those 9/10 knots days that I’m missing now. Not sure if the 12m would be enough or I should go for the 15m.

Thanks
Mariano

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby foilonfoil » Sat Aug 27, 2016 7:16 pm

1. Projected area of a foil kite is greater than an equivalent LEI and bridle system which means the foil kite is not bowed as much as an LEI so more kite surface area providing lift.
2. A foil kite bridle system by itself adds around 6M to line length and general rule of thumb is 3M of line length provide a 1M improvement in kite size. Currently flying my 15M foil with 16M lines but from bar to kite, that's still 22M.

A 15M Foil kite is equivalent to 17/19M LEI.

My major complaint with the Ozone Chrono is sand in the rear leading edge seam between seam stitching builds up over time and no way to remove unless you unpick the seam. This has never been a problem with the Flysurfers. Lots of other neat features with Flysurfers (LCL's etc) which make them an awesome all round long lasting kite.

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby windrider1 » Sat Aug 27, 2016 7:30 pm

I have been comparing this for a while now and before there were bow or SLE kites a foil kite had as much as 3 or even 4 m increase in power but now it's just about 2m. A SLE kite has a much greater projected area today than the old C kites . I would say that a 15m speed is equivalent to a 17m LEI. the flysyrfer lotus kites are some of the best light wind kites out there right now a 15 m would be perfect in 10 knts for your specific use with a foilboard. On a twintip however the 18 m is the ultinate low wind machine with a good mix of power and speed.
Last edited by windrider1 on Sat Aug 27, 2016 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

PullStrings
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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby PullStrings » Sat Aug 27, 2016 7:31 pm

Thank you foilonfoil...can't wait to read foilholio 2 cents on that

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby plummet » Sat Aug 27, 2016 8:27 pm

It definitely depends on what foil and what lei you are comparing to.

My 12m chrono appears to have a low end similar or better than a 17 zephur. It is definitely one kite size more powerful than my 13 edge so probably compares to a 15 edge.
My old 15m speed 3 had a wind wind range similar to my 12 chrono.

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby foilholio » Sun Aug 28, 2016 11:28 am

MarianoMoll wrote:How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites? Will a 15m Flysurfer Speed4 feel more like a 16 or 17 inflatable? Or it will have about the same power than a Contra 15m, for instance?

I’m learning to foil with a Cabrinha Double Agent and a Naish Torch 12m. At this point, I can foil up and down wind kind of decently, and I’m about to start practicing tacking and jibing. The 12m Torch gets me going at solid 11 knots. I’m thinking in getting a Flysurfer Speed3 or Speed4, or an Ozone Chrono V2 , but I’m not sure whether to get a 12m or a 15m. I weight 145lbs and I’m in South Florida. I’d like to be able to ride those 9/10 knots days that I’m missing now. Not sure if the 12m would be enough or I should go for the 15m.

Thanks
Mariano
Have you read viewtopic.php?f=197&t=2392648 ? Regis is about the same weight as you and hydrofoils on the 12m Pulsion lightweight version from about 4knots. I think that kite will suit you perfectly.

As to what foil compares to what inflatable most of the comments already are spot on. The reason foils out perform inflatables can be stated as simply they have a higher Lift to Drag ratio. It's the same reason hydrofoils are better.

foilonfoil wrote:My major complaint with the Ozone Chrono is sand in the rear leading edge seam between seam stitching builds up over time and no way to remove unless you unpick the seam.
A similar(same?) thing happens to flysurfers. Sand collects in the little cover on the TE seam. It's a slow process but it slowly fills up. From the sounds of it the chrono is much worse though, as it will take a few years before you notice it on a flysurfer. I am not a fan of the cover because of that,and kites I have had without a cover never collected any sand. A hose sprayed into the seam can get a lot of of it out though.

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby PullStrings » Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:45 pm

foilholio wrote: Regis is about the same weight as you and hydrofoils on the 12m Pulsion lightweight version from about 4knots.
Ignore his lies and propaganda :allbegood: .....a 12 sqm is a 12 sqm kite no matter how lightweight it is....it will not pull you up on a foilboard even if you weigh 60kg...50kg...40kg...30kg...20kg...10kg

Get the 15 ram air if you want to go in the wind you are after (and have fun) which will equal a LW specific 17 LEI

That Regis guy being quite experienced at foilboarding would have to be in a realistic 7-8 knots of wind at kite level to be able go...that's about 4 times more power than that stupid 4kn claim

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby foilholio » Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:37 pm

haha idiot number 2 is back lol.

Nope not all 12m kites or wings are made equal. The Pulsion seems to get very good performance. 10kg on a 12m is like 60kg on a 70-80m+ kite. You too like the twitspert can't even grasp basic physics. You are also particularly upset that people can ride in 4knots or less. You know you talk very much like PMU. Strange your and his obsession with foil kites when neither of you ride them.

Oh and that power is closer to 8 times rather than 4. Just so you know how great an accomplishment riding in 4knots or less is.

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby Johhnn » Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:03 pm

15 m is too big, IMHO. I weigh 170 and if my 12 m Lotus will stay up, I can foil with enough power to play.

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Re: How do foil kites sizes compare to inflatable kites?

Postby PullStrings » Sun Aug 28, 2016 8:11 pm

foilholio wrote: People can ride in 4 knots or less.
Oh and that power is closer to 8 times more rather than 4 ....(when you compare the power of 8 knots of wind to 4 knots of wind).
It is a great accomplishment riding in 4 knots or less .
You're as dumb as a bag of hammers :D
8kn divided by 4kn = 2.............the square of 2......2 times 2 = 4.......so 4 times stronger....not closer to 8 times :roll:

Here's an example for your four nuts brain.....how much stronger is a hurricane wind of 75 mph compared to a 25 mph wind
75 mph divided by 25 mph = 3......the square of 3.....3 times 3 = 9......so 9 times stronger

You would get beat up in the parking lot talking that 4 knots shit in South Florida :lol:


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