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Flysurfer Sonic 2

For all foil kite riders


Skywalker7
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby Skywalker7 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 2:05 pm

Try to loop or down loop a Sonic 1 or 2 18M and let see whats happening.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJxMwetXfw4&t=1s

phpBB [video]


This was my first ride on my friends Sonic 1 18M. I am 96 kg whithout the 7mm neoprene suit I had that time, and the wind could be 12-13 knots may be 14. My 86 kg friend was struggling a bit on a 15 M LF Envy at the back (on a 154x41 cm Crazyfly lightwind board) as you can see it on the video. Basicaly only the first jump is worth to see on the video as then the wind started to decrease to 10-12 knots. I am riding the Radical 5 L 138cm with my friend Sonic 1 18m.

The point is that this Sonic 1 18 m was not a slow turner but more importantly it generated a pretty consistent pull through the loop and due to its speed it generated way more power in the loop than any tube kite would do it so this was pretty exiting. Actually the power of the loop felt more like looping an 11 meter tube than the felt of downlooping a 18m in lightwind. The other kite in the video is a Flysurfer Boost 1 18m which is my kite and I like to loop it due to its tight turn radious but it generate much less power in the loop than the Sonic 1 18M. On the Video my friend is riding the Boost 1 18m who is some 94 kg on a 153x46cm lightwind board. (I write this data just for comparison)
Till now I was not a great fan on soft kites for the water (I am riding the Boost 18m, Boost 2 15m and Boost2 11m) but this experience was started make me thinking on a Sonic 2 18m.
I had one little tip tuck I guess (while it was my first ride ever on a Sonic) but it was much less than on my Speed 3 15m. Also due to its power this kite definitely takes more advanced kiter than a tube or a Speed series would require. But it gives way more height and hangtime, much better upwind than any 17 or 18m tube would deliver and much more power in the loops. Actually this was the best surpirise for me about this Sonic 18 m that it loops pretty nice, but you can see it on the video.

windrider1
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby windrider1 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 2:41 pm

I think a lot of people that comment of these kites don't really have real up to date experience flying them , may be they owned a speed 3 or speed 2 but that's about it. The thing is every year these kites get better and better ive been flying flysurfers for a long time and can attest that every year there is an improvement in the kites. There is no way that flying an LEI in 8 or 10 knts is more fun than a Sonic or speed 5 that's just absolutely nonsense. In 8-10knts u will probally need a 18m LEI which is a complete dog compared to a race kite lets face it. A good race kite will propel you throught the water much faster and the lift and power the kite delivers is much more and thats all that's the ingredients to have a lot of fun.

kitexpert
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby kitexpert » Sat Dec 31, 2016 6:53 pm

If over 210lbs weight Skywalker7 feels Sonic1 18m is not slow turning at 12-14kn I don't wonder. For light weight kiter it doesn't mean much, that kite is slow for him.

I've set my personal limit for foil size to 15m. It turns slower than 17m LEI but pulls more, so I could very well use either one. And I have. But new 13m size of Sonic2 might be the best combination between power/handling.

First jump was nice and that loop surprised me. Well done :thumb:

I know very well foil kite produces more pull when looped - and what is often very useful - for a longer time than a LEI. Power comes late part of the loop because the inertia needs time to get speed up. LEI's have more differencies between different kites how much they generate power when looped.

foilholio
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby foilholio » Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:01 am

Toby wrote: The most stupid thing is when a beginner says he wants a fast kite, and then trying the first tricks.
Exactly. What is extra funny is the best riders like slow turning kites, easier to do handle passes on etc. What also is funny is the guys that want super fast turning kites for waves etc then don't turn them or don't turn them fast.... I think a lot confusion stems that many good riders want a fast "flying" kite but with slow stable turning. See you can always slow a kite down by pulling on it, but your slow kite with it's fat tube( by rainbow tail obsessed designer), well it is continually speed limited.

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Kamikuza
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby Kamikuza » Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:12 am

kitexpert wrote:I've set my personal limit for foil size to 15m. It turns slower than 17m LEI but pulls more, so I could very well use either one. And I have. But new 13m size of Sonic2 might be the best combination between power/handling.
Me too, the other way around though -- tubes over about 12m are IMO too big, slow and trucklike. If I've going to suffer all that, I may as well use a foil and have a kite that cranks upwind properly and has a mountain of lift.

I'm very close to buying a Sonic 18 but worry it may actually be too big and powerful . . .

kitejumping
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby kitejumping » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:38 pm

Kamikuza wrote:
kitexpert wrote:I've set my personal limit for foil size to 15m. It turns slower than 17m LEI but pulls more, so I could very well use either one. And I have. But new 13m size of Sonic2 might be the best combination between power/handling.
Me too, the other way around though -- tubes over about 12m are IMO too big, slow and trucklike. If I've going to suffer all that, I may as well use a foil and have a kite that cranks upwind properly and has a mountain of lift.

I'm very close to buying a Sonic 18 but worry it may actually be too big and powerful . . .
My sonic fr 18m is my most used and favorite kite for flat and lower angle terrain (snowkiting). There have been many times when it's the only kite in the air, and when there is enough wind for LEIs to start riding the 18m has enough power to start jumping. I only use my 15m if I'd be way overpowered on the 18 or if it's gusty. Even my 11m will get me moving before the LEIs can launch, the trick is to keep the kite moving in light wind and don't let it overfly itself.

On a side note, has anyone done continuous kiteloops with a sonic 2 to pull themselves up steep terrain snowkiting? To loop the 11m sonic fr you pretty much need to have the bar all the way in when turning it or it won't make the rotation around. Wondering if the sonic 2 takes the same amount of pulling the bar in to loop.

Every tube kite I've flown (not very many) I find sluggish and boring to fly, but I can see where the predictability and slow handling would help for unhooked freestyle tricks or super high winds.

foilholio
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby foilholio » Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:59 pm

You can loop tighter using the rear leaders, pass from one hand to the other. Longer lines help as well to loop but are trickier around trees :-).

kitexpert
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby kitexpert » Tue Jan 03, 2017 1:00 pm

foilholio wrote:What is extra funny is the best riders like slow turning kites,
Nonsense. For example D.Maramenides has underlined the speed (turning speed) of the kite for making tricks easier. So basic trick as a transition jump benefits greatly fast turning kite, then redirecting is of course easier. Unhook guys use short bars to control turning speeds, but still C-kites they use have higher turning speed than any foil kite has.

Most seasoned kiters I know appreciate fast kites so much they don't use even bigger LEI's any more, but only lighting fast small wave kites. But for a beginner slow turning and slow flying kite is a good choice, it doesn't get out of control so easily and kiter is not punished too much for his mistakes.

I think Toby's opinions are a bit too far from normal kiters views. He is quite heavy and strong professional who uses his big kites in high winds.

So, let's not try to turn the wheel of kite evolution backwards :) If someone really would like to have a slow kite he should consider some big old FS kite, like 21m or 26m Psycho2. I'm sure there is still some of these around, very durable kites and if a bit out of tune they are even slower :D

However I remember when P3 arrived everyone was amazed how much faster it turned than P2, no one was sorry about that. This development has continued because most kiters like fast and lively kites, not slow dogs.
foilholio wrote:but your slow kite with it's fat tube( by rainbow tail obsessed designer), well it is continually speed limited.
Like those LF Envys and Airush DNAs doing 60-70mph or more on ice?

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Toby
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby Toby » Tue Jan 03, 2017 1:38 pm

Yes, I'm heavier and can handle power.

But all friends and people who like Airstyle and listen to me, now ride bigger kites and are having a blast progressing a lot.

Slower kite and power are the secret of Airstyle.

Regis-de-giens
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Re: Flysurfer Sonic 2

Postby Regis-de-giens » Tue Jan 03, 2017 2:20 pm

Toby wrote:Slower kite and power are the secret of Airstyle.
Hi Toby,
by "slower" you mean slow to turn and rapid to cross the window ( i.e. performance race kite) or slow to cross the window and quick turn (i.e. like wave kites or C-shapes) ?


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