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Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

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rtz
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Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby rtz » Tue Feb 21, 2017 7:32 pm

I buggy with fixed bridle kites. I can kiteboard with LEI's. Looking for my first closed cell to use on the water. Want something that is tame and well behaved.

HQ Matrixx III? Something from Pansh(half price sale going on)? Chrono? Something else?


Considering two kites. Maybe a 9 and 12? One for wind that is blowing in the 20's up to 30 and one when it it blowing 12-15 upwards to 20mph.

Is there even a beginner oriented foil kite on the market?

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby edt » Tue Feb 21, 2017 7:54 pm

the step from an inflated kite to a foil is not that big, so don't let yourself being a beginner stop you from buying a more "advanced" aka high aspect foil. They can be a bit tricky to fly sometimes but it's not as big of a jump as you get going from a 2 line trainer to a real power kite. If you have your eye on the chrono pick it up, that's fine as a first foil kite. I don't like any of the HQ matrixx kites, sorry, the performance at least in the past has never been what I like in a foil. The pansh kites are great for the price can't be beat for value. If you are kiting in very gusty conditions you will still want to fall back on a tube kite because no matter how well behaved a foil kite is, they can still get into bowties and wing folds that will never happen on a tube kite. Like anything else, the best way to figure out what you like is to go try it! See if there are kiters at your launch that let you borrow their foil kites for a little bit. Probably the trickest thing to learn on a foil is the launching and landing which are different from a tube. When landing you don't grab the leading edge, you grab one of the ends and it flags out from there. Launching typically is done as a hot launch on a foil, as they don't generate much power until they inflate, so they won't loft you right away from a hot launch like a tube kite will. There are lots of low aspect foils out there but I probably wouldn't bother with them, go straight for the high performance foils. It doesn't take too long to learn how to fly them. Maybe watch a few videos about the differences.

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby socommk23 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 8:20 pm

^ what he said.
My 2 pence.....
If you can fly lei......and open cell race kites in a buggy. Youll be fine with a closed cell high performance kite. They are easy to fly. But they have to be flown well. If that makes sense? Just keep in mind they can give a few more issues with relaunch from water.
Pansh for cost. Auora2 is nice on water. Or if you can afford maybe flysurfer sonic, chrono v2?

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby Mossy 757 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:40 pm

I'm a believer in the new Flysurfer Sonic2's...having flown the 15m, I think it's so easy to fly you could pretty much teach a first-time lesson with it. The Speed5 is a slight bit lower performance in terms of top speed and upwind ability, but even easier to use and handle. From what I've heard, same goes for the ChronoV2. I've flown, not ridden, the R1V2 and it's every bit as stable and easy to handle in the air as the Sonic2 but costs 50% more money, so not sure it's a good first foil kite.

Closed cell foils aren't inherently more difficult, there's just different techniques than with an LEI. In my opinion, foil kites can do a lot more things than inflatables when it comes to kite handling; they're more dynamic and interesting all around than even a really good LEI.

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby socommk23 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:50 pm

F.one diablos are also very very good kites. Easy to fly. Easier to launch and inflate than the sonic2 imo and more stable wing tips than chrono. With the v2 out there are some good 2nd hand v1s around

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby Horst Sergio » Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:02 am

rtz wrote:... Looking for my first closed cell to use on the water. Want something that is tame and well behaved.

HQ Matrixx III? Something from Pansh(half price sale going on)? Chrono? Something else? ...
Hi rtz,

don't know the Pansh and Matrix just Nr. I too long ago. If you find a 12 m² or 10 m² Flysurfer Speed 4 Lotus for a good price this can be interesting. If you want something that will never cause you big trouble relaunching. The 12 is very beginner friendly but still interesting enough, the 10 is even more livelily but no problem, especially as you already have good experience. The 8 is not bad, but not so nice compared to the other two.

But its always about what you are looking for. The Lotus is for sure tame but still sportive, I used both mentioned sizes two years ago and world cupper Peter Müller was a lot on the 15 m² having fun for sure and another friend and very good and experienced soft kiter is actually still on the 10 m².

But if it is more important to have the most extrem, hardcore race kite on the beach and "IN" the water than IMHO go for a R1, Chrono, Sonic or Diablo:
http://kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=197&t=2395433 :wink:

My preferences are to come back 100% with the kite in the air as long there is enough wind to launch and relaunch it, which is around 6 knts for the Lotus.
http://kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=19 ... 62#p951762 :)

I am sure you are going to make a good decision. :D


(and to add an extra one:
This very talented friend with around 8 years of experience on high AR water soft kites, doing big kiteloops with tubes and soft kites on the second flour, etc. said more than 2 times: "Thank you for the advice, to put my sonic aside for learning foilboarding and to buy a Lotus." :wink: )

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby plummet » Wed Feb 22, 2017 3:01 am

Hey man. I kite buggy and kitesurf.

If you can fly lei and fixed bridle kitesurf and buggy you are not a beginner. Go straight to the kite you want

The stable kite good for general riding is a speed.

12m will work good to 20mph. I think 9 might work to mid 20's but you will be getting punished unless heavy close to 30mph. That's 7m weather in my book.

Now on the buggy I love the super high aspect race foils. Chrono and r1 are magic....... so fast, so stable, stupid upwind.

Fixed bridle will be dead to you after stepping into closed ccel race foil!

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby socommk23 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:45 am

plummet wrote:
Now on the buggy I love the super high aspect race foils. Chrono and r1 are magic....... so fast, so stable, stupid upwind.

Fixed bridle will be dead to you after stepping into closed ccel race foil!
I hear that ^^^^^

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby Nem0 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:41 pm

A few years ago I tested a speed3. After that I never want to fly a foilkite... just used tubes for a couple of years...
2015 I tested the flysurfer sonicFR in 15 and bought it in 15 and 9! Loved this combination.
Last year I bought a used 10m speed4 lotus. In gusty conditions it's more stable to the 9m sonicFR.
The handling of the sonic2 should bei a bit easier than the sonicFR but for testing this I've to wait till april ;-)

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Re: Best closed cell foil for a beginner?

Postby Regis-de-giens » Fri Feb 24, 2017 2:33 am

Indeed you will be confortable with foilkite very rapidly !
What is your board type ? TT , hydrofoil ?
I use both and have riden
-speed 3 (not the best ... ) ,
- aurora v1 (better for low end),
- speed4 Lotus 10m (great and wonderful relaunchable cloth, but too small in 10m for TT)
-Aurora 2 light 15m (comparable to lotus IMO while much cheaper),
- Pulsion (my prefered today on TT , hydrofoil and snow).

Recent Pelican and Navy2 also seem a good options to consider, their ratio is not as extreme as pure race kites (comparable to speed5 and chrono2 IMO but probably better in very light winds on a hydrofoil).


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