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Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:46 pm
by opie
Mossy 757 wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:32 pm
It's also possible to sheet the kite in so that it's stalled in the wind window, then ease the bar out and the kite will pop forward to the edge of the window and pull you out of the water.
Yeah, I've watched people do this, and understand the concept, but have never pulled it off myself. Does the kite need to be on the higher half of its wind range for it to work?

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:53 pm
by Mossy 757
opie wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:46 pm
Mossy 757 wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:32 pm
It's also possible to sheet the kite in so that it's stalled in the wind window, then ease the bar out and the kite will pop forward to the edge of the window and pull you out of the water.
Yeah, I've watched people do this, and understand the concept, but have never pulled it off myself. Does the kite need to be on the higher half of its wind range for it to work?
More power makes it easier; I think short-lines and being in the upper half of the wind range helps a lot.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:57 pm
by Blackrat
You don't say what board you riding ?

I do a similar thing when I drive to hard upwind and then start pulling on the bar for more power and start to go slower and slower lol

I find on the foil the upwind angle is sensitive to the wind speed , if I'm in the zone then I can go upwind like crazy.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:46 pm
by windrider1
Ure stalling the kite dude. First make sure all your lines are equal in length. Most times center lines become longer in relation to back lines and this is a no no for a foil kite. Is this a new kite or used?? Depower the kite at the trim strap ie: no confusion there pull the strap in - In fact pull the trim strap almost all the way in and fly the kite in the middle to top of its windrance guranteed all your problems will disappear.


opie wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:03 pm
From what you guys are saying I think I am being too hamfisted. And stalling the kite by pulling in the bar too much.
On water starts I usually get up by diving the kite and pushing the bar out. But then I often lose power/speed and drop back to the surface.
While riding sometimes I just slow down, I don't know why, and lose momentum and power. The thing that is frustrating me is I will trim out (longer front lines) and try that for a while, then trim in and try that for a while, but I don't seem to do better either way. I guess I just don't have enough feel yet to know what I am doing wrong.
The weird thing is I usually do great on jibes. I have no problem down looping and keeping speed and power through the turn. And on every 4rth or 5th waterstart or so I just take off and fly away no problem, plenty of power.
Turning

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:09 pm
by socommk23
windrider1 wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:46 pm
Ure stalling the kite dude. First make sure all your lines are equal in length. Most times center lines become longer in relation to back lines and this is a no no for a foil kite. Is this a new kite or used?? Depower the kite at the trim strap ie: no confusion there pull the strap in - In fact pull the trim strap almost all the way in and fly the kite in the middle to top of its windrance guranteed all your problems will disappear.


opie wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:03 pm
From what you guys are saying I think I am being too hamfisted. And stalling the kite by pulling in the bar too much.
On water starts I usually get up by diving the kite and pushing the bar out. But then I often lose power/speed and drop back to the surface.
While riding sometimes I just slow down, I don't know why, and lose momentum and power. The thing that is frustrating me is I will trim out (longer front lines) and try that for a while, then trim in and try that for a while, but I don't seem to do better either way. I guess I just don't have enough feel yet to know what I am doing wrong.
The weird thing is I usually do great on jibes. I have no problem down looping and keeping speed and power through the turn. And on every 4rth or 5th waterstart or so I just take off and fly away no problem, plenty of power.
Turning
I see a lot of people doing this with lei kites. In low wind they think more power is the key where actually it makes it harder. Moving kite makes better power.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:27 pm
by davesails7
When it's really light and im stopped, (entering water or after a fall) I let the trim line all the way out to full power and keep the kite partially stalled. Then to get start i just let the bar out to let it move through the loop. As soon as im up on foil, ill pull the depower 4 or 5 inches (on 4 to 1 depower) to go upwind.

I think when you are stopped full power is the way to go. Backstalling a foil is not a problem, you cam recover from a backstall by just easing the bar a bit. IF you let it breath too mich it will over fly you and could collapse in a lull.

I've only got experience with race foil kites (chrono, sonic1, sonic2) so that may be the difference, but I've always felt that backstall is your friend in marginal conditions when not moving.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:29 pm
by davesails7
davesails7 wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:27 pm
When it's really light and im stopped, (entering water or after a fall) I let the trim line all the way out to full power and keep the kite partially stalled. Then to get started i just let the bar out to let it move through the loop. As soon as im up on foil, ill pull the depower 4 or 5 inches (on 4 to 1 depower) to go upwind.

I think when you are stopped full power is the way to go. Backstalling a foil is not a problem, you cam recover from a backstall by just easing the bar a bit. If you let it breath too much it will over fly you and could collapse in a lull.

I've only got experience with race foil kites (chrono, sonic1, sonic2) so that may be the difference, but I've always felt that backstall is your friend in marginal conditions when not moving.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:29 am
by sedluk
Lots of good recommendations, keep the kite moving. I think a subtle recommendation is when you want power, let the kite fly quickly and once it is moving quickly you can get a little extra power by pulling in the bar. Pulling in the bar while the kite is flying quickly will give you a little more power but it also slows the kite so it can only be used for a short time. Once the kite is not flying through the window as quickly, it will loose power. The tricky part can often be expecting when the kite will loose enough speed and to loosing up on the bar before the kite slows down too much.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:08 am
by opie
I am using a Ketos FR2 wing, and my lines are just a few sessions old and all even.

Today I had a couple hours and did a little better. I made a point of pulling the trim in more than usual and it worked better. I need to work on turning the kite without losing all the momentum. A few times today I did a good job of this and I can see that I have been pulling the bar in too much to help turn the kite. I need to learn to turn with more of a sweeping turn and less pivot.

Thanks so much for all the advice, I have a long way to go but at least I feel like I have some direction.

Re: light wind trim?

Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:30 am
by windrider1
Ok now ure getting the hang of it. What Brand foil kite are you using. some brands need a little more skill than others. ozones are a little less stall prone than lets say flysurfer .Also if its a well used kite it may require some tuning .


opie wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:08 am
I am using a Ketos FR2 wing, and my lines are just a few sessions old and all even.

Today I had a couple hours and did a little better. I made a point of pulling the trim in more than usual and it worked better. I need to work on turning the kite without losing all the momentum. A few times today I did a good job of this and I can see that I have been pulling the bar in too much to help turn the kite. I need to learn to turn with more of a sweeping turn and less pivot.

Thanks so much for all the advice, I have a long way to go but at least I feel like I have some direction.