Forum for kitesurfers
-
tomtom
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 1693
- Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
-
Has thanked:
23 times
-
Been thanked:
218 times
Postby tomtom » Thu Apr 03, 2003 12:56 pm
Firs please appoligize my bad english
I very like your topic SQ225917 COMES CLEAN........ so this is reason why ask you
Im going to new kites and i choose between titan and toro2.
Im beginer to intermediate kiter (Can stay upwind - riding in tarifa in 2m waves but i cannot start jump until now) Im came from windsurf /5 years/ and in opposite to other kiter i know for me is just cruising and carving pretty fun - not only jumping. (But i want also jump of course) I also kiting on snow with snowboard.
I heght 86 kg - 190 pounds and im very tall 2m
My current quiver is FS Mastair 12 for very light wind (i start from 9 knts with 180 twintip) and sets of Gun strong kites 13,6 - 6,6 (4 liner intermediate Tube) for medium and high wind.
I like easy setup of mast air and his low wind ability. But i dont like undirect feeling on bar and slow turning.
So what i should buy set of TORO or TITAN
We have very gusty inland wind i im often alone so i prefer titan for self launching but what about stability in AIR. MA is quite stabil on zenit but ustable on edge: How is feel on titans bar? And how is titan turnig speed and edge stability vs leis (T2) and vs Mast air in comparable sizes.
And im slightly biased to T2 becouse i can buy it for much better price.
But in my mind i prefer TITAN.
Thanks a lot for help
Tomas
-
tomtom
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 1693
- Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
-
Has thanked:
23 times
-
Been thanked:
218 times
Postby tomtom » Thu Apr 03, 2003 1:33 pm
... And i forgot im thinking also about Guerilas for they well know stability
So my choose are
Titans , Guerilas and Toros II
Thanks a lot
Everybody answer is welcome
Tom
-
sq225917
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 8789
- Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
- Kiting since: 1996
- Local Beach: Cleethorpes, Hunstanton, Lytham
- Gear: Eleveight and Flysurfer
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
1 time
-
Been thanked:
9 times
Postby sq225917 » Thu Apr 03, 2003 7:40 pm
well i've not tried the toro 2 so i can't comment on that.
the titans set up and relaunch is the same as the mast air, but you can launch it completely uninflated, from downwind or at the side of the wind.
the kite comes with the rotor leash and the standard leash you are used too on the mast air. the rotor leash allows you to spin the bar at will without tangling the leash at all. this is the best system i've seen as it is fully intergrated with the water relaunch and self correction.
the titan has a decent amount of bar pull, not the pressureless depower of the mast air, just like an lei.. and about 3x the depower of the mast air on half the bar movement. the titan has a depower and trim strap set up just like an lei, but more effective.
stability wise, compared to the mast air its off the scale, i've not managed to get one wet in over a month of riding it. at the edge of the window the jet flaps make it incredibly stable removing any tendency to tuck or stall.
it is the very best foil i've used for stability, but i've not tried the g-arcs.
i can't tell you which one to go for. if you like the ease of setup and relaunch then go for it, any lei will be no more stable through the wind.
though you might well get better height from an lei..
try one,..
-
tomtom
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 1693
- Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
-
Has thanked:
23 times
-
Been thanked:
218 times
Postby tomtom » Thu Apr 03, 2003 9:07 pm
thanks SQ very much
I have one more question please. When im talking about bar feeling i think steering responses and forces that you know where the kite is and what doing. You start steering you feel resistance and can feel that kite start turning - less resistance you can do little corection with small bar movements (LEI case) No way with MA 12 almost always full bar movement with very little resistance. I know it save my energy but it is not funny
How is TITAN vs MASTAIR vs LEI in this
Thanks
Tom
-
sq225917
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 8789
- Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
- Kiting since: 1996
- Local Beach: Cleethorpes, Hunstanton, Lytham
- Gear: Eleveight and Flysurfer
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
1 time
-
Been thanked:
9 times
Postby sq225917 » Thu Apr 03, 2003 10:08 pm
just like an lei there is feeling from the bar all the time with the titan unless you have it over depowered.
unlike the mast airs flying the titan totally blind without looking at the kite is easy. the amount of force generated on the bar tells you exactly where in the window the kite is.
the titan pulls on one side of the bar with increasing force as it tracks out to the side of the window, the bar feel is light, but definately gives enough feedback to locate the kite without looking.
when looping the feedback from the bar is less confusing than with an lei. i don't know if anyone else notices this but you can feel the point at which the lines cross over on an lei, literally as the lines run into each other, i find this disconcerting and makes me look at the kite to check things are ok.
because the contact points on the bridles on the titan and psycho are so close together, the lines cross over much closer to the kite when doing loops, and i don't feel the ''twang'' through the bar as the lines cross. it feels smoother on the titan and psycho, but then again on the lei's i know when i'm exactly half way around...
-
tomtom
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 1693
- Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
-
Has thanked:
23 times
-
Been thanked:
218 times
Postby tomtom » Thu Apr 03, 2003 10:27 pm
Thank you very much for comprehensive information
That exact i want to know
Thanks one more time
-
Vega
- Medium Poster
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2003 12:47 pm
-
Has thanked:
0
-
Been thanked:
0
Postby Vega » Thu Apr 03, 2003 11:06 pm
Hi SQ
Another Q from a nother kiter
I'm used to flying foils, and i like the tractor feeling of pull, the way U just park 'em and then they just pull. I've tried an older LEI and I don't like the way you have to sine the kite ( could imagine that's why a lot of kiters have prob's with their albovs).
Now to the Q: How does the Titan fly? Do you have to sine it, or is it more of a tractor, where u park it? How's the development in the LEI's, U mentioned a lot in your "cleaning out my closet" thread
about the development of the flysurfer, but U did'nt really mention the big(?) improivements in LEI.
The reason I'm asking is because I'm realy wondering wether to get the Titan or a LEI...
-
sq225917
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 8789
- Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
- Kiting since: 1996
- Local Beach: Cleethorpes, Hunstanton, Lytham
- Gear: Eleveight and Flysurfer
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
1 time
-
Been thanked:
9 times
Postby sq225917 » Thu Apr 03, 2003 11:33 pm
if you just want to get something to park under then a foil is the way to go.
with their greater projected area to total size foils are going to give you more 'static' pull when just placed in the air. because you don't have to sine them the power delivery is more constant. it was this constant pull that i credit with allowing me to really dial my upwind riding. without having to take into account the effect of moving the kite and constant powering depowering of sining its much easier to just get on with board position and railing hard.
i personally prefer a foils power delivery, especially when really low to the water, much lower than you benefit from taking an lei. i ride an ultra short board so being able to get constant truck out of the kite is kinda important. aslo being able to park the kite and leave it right at the edge of the wind the whole time makes upwind better, with my riding style anyway.
i guess i could just put a bigger lei up instead, but because of the 180'o curve in an lei they pull much differently lower to the ground then they do at their optimal higher position. perhaps its me but my lei is only really at its best above 30 degrees above the water. my foils pull the same way in the same direction almost until its in the water.
? do other people notice this?
the titan is much more lei like than any previous foil i've used, it really sines well when underpowered, and they generate a lot of aceleration even in the bottom of an upturn, which is great is you are trying to milk it when underpowered. but to answer your question, in the right wind you can just park it and go, if thats what you want, they have a lot of raw power for their size even compared to the higher aspect ratio psycho.
like a mid aspect lei they feel grunty, but not at the expense of sitting further back in the window, they go right to the edge of the wind like the psycho, they just dont stall like the psycho.
i'd definately give one a fair go if you fancy a kite that pulls and sits like a foil but has a lot of lei like characteristics as well.
-
Vega
- Medium Poster
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2003 12:47 pm
-
Has thanked:
0
-
Been thanked:
0
Postby Vega » Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:24 am
Cheers!
Thanx for the really quick answer!
I give the Titan a go,
Actually my only concern about the foils is their stalling and then earflapping inearflapping. And their ability to overfly you in a jump.
I really look forward to the Titan, hopefully it solves those prob's.
Regarding jump height I'm willing to give up a bit of height, to be quick on and off water AND doesn't stall.
-
Mr Jo Macdonald
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 2185
- Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:00 am
- Brand Affiliation: None
- Location: Spain/Italy
-
Has thanked:
0
-
Been thanked:
0
Postby Mr Jo Macdonald » Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:17 am
Simon, I think you've tried them both so would you say the 12m titan has the same low end as the 12m mastair below 10 knots?
Return to “Kitesurfing”
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: Abaltasis, Baidu [Spider], Blackened, chidism, cor, Faxie, FunOnTheWater, jannik, lucas33, Matty V, MKM, nixmatters, purdyd, Sander O, Tiiga, Vivo3d, W3C [Validator] and 359 guests