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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:24 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:02 am
Posts: 124
Satan, Rick has done more for the safety of this sport than you've ever done. In fact, I doubt you've ever done a single damn thing regarding the safety of this sport.


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:14 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2004 5:12 pm
Posts: 26
Sigh...Ok here goes..
I usually stay away from posting, choosing instead to lurk on the outside just reading posts, but this time I have to chip in. There are things that Satan says that I agree with and things that I don't.
But the one thing I emphatically agree with is the fact that Rick does all these things in an effort on self promotion. I admit that Rick's information has probably helped many kiters from being injured, but his attitude of "I am the one and only savior" really irks me. The best example I can give is when a friend called me a couple of years ago to tell me a fellow kiter had been badly injured in Miami and asked for my help in raising funds to help him out. I posted on kite fourm telling about the incident and asking for assistance. Very soon thereafter I received a direct email from Rick saying that I was wrong to post anything about the incident and that I should wait until he posts his version of the accident....(I'll probably get one from him after this posting also..) He basically stated that he was the only one who should be reporting these types of events. There is nothing wrong with trying to help people out, but when you do it to build up your own self image it's straight out creepy. I know I will probably get slammed for this post and I don't really care. I just needed to vent the feelings I have had bottled up inside ever since that incident. Toby, you can ban me if you want. I already told you how you how I felt about Rick when I first met you at Surf Expo years back and you didn't take it well then either. So ban away if you wish. As for you Rick, report the facts and keep helping people, just take the ego out of it.


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:07 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 5:35 pm
Posts: 1150
I'd suggest

Anytime anyone uses their real name here, you can pretty much rest assured,,,

they're out to make a name for themselves...

Read, on the make.one way or another...

well? that's how I see it anyway...

transcribed by

[sic] my proxy


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:22 pm 
Shpoing wrote:
Sigh...Ok here goes..
I usually stay away from posting, choosing instead to lurk on the outside just reading posts, but this time I have to chip in. There are things that Satan says that I agree with and things that I don't.
But the one thing I emphatically agree with is the fact that Rick does all these things in an effort on self promotion. I admit that Rick's information has probably helped many kiters from being injured, but his attitude of "I am the one and only savior" really irks me. The best example I can give is when a friend called me a couple of years ago to tell me a fellow kiter had been badly injured in Miami and asked for my help in raising funds to help him out. I posted on kite fourm telling about the incident and asking for assistance. Very soon thereafter I received a direct email from Rick saying that I was wrong to post anything about the incident and that I should wait until he posts his version of the accident....(I'll probably get one from him after this posting also..) He basically stated that he was the only one who should be reporting these types of events. There is nothing wrong with trying to help people out, but when you do it to build up your own self image it's straight out creepy. I know I will probably get slammed for this post and I don't really care. I just needed to vent the feelings I have had bottled up inside ever since that incident. Toby, you can ban me if you want. I already told you how you how I felt about Rick when I first met you at Surf Expo years back and you didn't take it well then either. So ban away if you wish. As for you Rick, report the facts and keep helping people, just take the ego out of it.


Sounds about right.

Rick may have started out trying to help. He is now more into the celebrity of being "our savior".
I couldn't agree more. I have been reading Rick and attempting to interact with him for several years now.

Look back at all his posts (if you want to waste a lot of time).
You will notice a clear trend to simply ignore anyone that addresses him that isn't an icon and vice versa - the trend to go out of his way to their kiss their as.ses if they are.
Somehow some people have interpreted this as being diplomatic. (?)
After seeing literally years of not so much cooperating, but posts limited to exchanging with "the guys", I gave up on interacting with Rick on a forum.

If your goal is genuinely safety (and not looking good), you would have also become frustrated and picked up on this.

Rick has been more interested in becoming an icon than promoting safety for quite some time. If this was not the case, you would see him put some Florida shop owners/instructors/icons asses to the fire and demand safety (at least ONCE....). I have yet to ever see him do this.
Instead, he is complacent to rub shoulders with them on podcasts and stroke their egos.

I recently quit FKA (Rick's forum) because I got so sick of seeing that kind of crap.
The last straw was when he actually congratulated a local shop employee for taking initiative, when all the guy did was avoid my question over what the shop's take was on some very basic SAFETY guidelines. In other words, the shop guy listed zero guidelines.
Yet Rick congratulates him for taking initiative? What a hypocrite.

I have also been reading Toby now for years as well. No way he is going to ban you over this.


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:07 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 2:18 am
Posts: 98
Uh, whether he's really trying to or not, what's wrong with making a name for yourself?

tittering group of schoolgirls needs to grow up


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:22 pm 
Good question Meh Yam.

The problem with trying to make a name for yourself while attempting to affect change at the same time is that the two can be contradictory pursuits. In trying to make a name for yourself and become widely accepted, it is often necessary not only to avoid offending people, but to make "buddy buddy" with the perceived kiting icons in Florida. Calling people out for poor decisions/practices offends them.
That is not a good buddy move.

To become accepted (and not resented) it becomes difficult to effectively put heat on the status quo (status quo in Florida has been pretty lame now for some time, if you haven't noticed... ban, ban, ban, accident, ban... ) We really do have A LOT of shit going on down here, if you weren't aware.
Many of us feel bans may be coming (many already have).

To become accepted and liked, it is unlikely you are going to ask any tough questions or do much in terms of being proactive. It would be easier to state the obvious - "Don't go out in storms", and then tell us "What went wrong" when a guy does get lofted in a 60 knot gust.

The reason I now view Rick as counterproductive is that many people in Fl view him as our leader in terms of safety. I guarantee you the yahoos in Florida that don't ride safely/responsibly are totally cumfy with that. They know that RickI would never confront them or ask them what they are doing.

Case in point. Rick did an exceptionally detailed analysis of why a guy flew across the street at high speed in a 60 knot gust and why being caught in a 60 knot gust is dangerous. But not once did he ask the local Fort Lauderdale crew "What were you thinking?" "Why were you out there?". "Will YOU guys be out there again?"

Hey. Maybe there were valid answers to these questions. Maybe there were not.
Either way, Rick sure never asked questions. Instead, he actually posted a banner ad that said -
"This could happen to any one of us"

I had real concerns over what Rick would say in a T.V. interview given that he posted that banner ad.
Why did he post it on here? I had to conclude it was a favor. Doing favors is fine I guess. But when the message is contradictory do what you preach? Can't be buddy buddy and stick to your guns, apparently.

If we REALLY want to learn from accidents, we need to start addressing the people involved. They are the ones that truly predict outcomes. Not the weather.
Rick conveniently focuses all his in depth analysis on the storm, playing it safe.
BTW, by far my greatest concerns are for behaviors in "normal wind". Like riding way too close to shore and other people in the water. We can never blame the weather for that.

That might give you a little more insight to my concerns, Meh Yam.
That's definitely my take on the Florida scene right now, not just Rick. Many are way more invested in looking cool (hey... Kevin looked really cool, didn't he?) and promotion than just about anything.


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 4:42 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:23 am
Posts: 3332
Location: The United Mistakes of America
Rick has done tons of research - what have you guys done?


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:03 pm
Posts: 154
fwiw, other kites are seen in the video with kite low. Obviously they were not lofted.

Kite high in gusty conditions while riding into shore overpowered == kook.


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:54 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:03 pm
Posts: 154
My opinion is that RickI is just trying to become a celebrity.

He describes in detail every accident after the fact, salivating, and gloriously linking to his own web site covered with banner ads. Promoting safety is not reporting accidents after the fact. If this were the case the news media would be "promoting safety" every time they report a double murder.

I almost think he does it to convince his friends and others that kiteboarding is "extreme"... "See how dangerous it is?? I do it, see how crazy I am??". Sky diver mentality.

Regardless though, we see the same crew, who has been blamed repeatedly for littering up the beaches, riding in swim zones, and facing bans, having their asses kissed by glorious RickI simply because they are recognized in the industry.

All wind up and no pitch.


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 Post subject: Re: Safety Rick Isn't Safe
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 6:08 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:23 am
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Location: The United Mistakes of America
fkb wrote:
Kite high in gusty conditions while riding into shore overpowered == kook.


That's the explanation that Satan wants you to believe, but it's not that simple. The guy with the kite low was getting dragged toward a bunch of boats - he was just lucky someone grabbed his kite first.

Some conditions cannot be overcome by skill or experience - only luck. There are MANY examples of this - you can find a few exceptions, but look at all the serious accidents that have happened and you'll find PLENTY of skilled/experienced guys getting nailed by extreme conditions. Those 2 guys went out in conditions that required luck instead of skill, and only one of them had it.


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