*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 49 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2002 5:55 pm 
Offline
Rare Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 46
Location: The Netherlands
Quote:
On 2002-10-02 17:35, fokiten wrote:
I have not read all the posts (wow) yet i am interested in understanding what you all are talking about, Whats an AOA for that matter where can I go (don't get cute) to get definions? for all the foil/tube speak acronims?


Hi,

here is some explaination what AoA is and what it does:
http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/incline.html

This also interesting:
http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/presar.html

Have fun, Henry


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2002 7:25 pm 
Offline
Frequent Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 469
Location: Copenhagen Denmark
You forget that the LEI/ARC shape has a huge amount of drag from the tips which contribute absolutely zero to lift, power, speed, etc. Their only attribute is to slow the kite down by increasing drag.

That is one of the reasons, I think there is so much future in flat foils like the flysurfers. More power and faster.

Marc
GoExtreme.dk


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2002 7:28 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 1776
Location: Vancouver, Canada. rides Naish,Ozone,North, Spotz,Aguera
For a glossary of kitesurfing terms go to:
http://www.kitesurfingschool.org/glossary.htm


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2002 7:58 pm 
Offline
Rare Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 46
Location: The Netherlands
Quote:
On 2002-10-02 20:25, mmunzer wrote:
You forget that the LEI/ARC shape has a huge amount of drag from the tips which contribute absolutely zero to lift, power, speed, etc. Their only attribute is to slow the kite down by increasing drag.

That is one of the reasons, I think there is so much future in flat foils like the flysurfers. More power and faster.

Marc
GoExtreme.dk


It's a close run, Bridledrag on flat foils vs tipdrag in sleds.

On buggykites, the Hi-Arc has a better L/D ratio than the best bridled foil...

Have fun, Henry


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2002 10:11 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 626
Dear Arcsrule and everyone that rides foil kites, yes some of my posts seem harsh, but if you have a look they are posted to people who also have interests financially in the success of their foil kites and usually those are the people that I am after. I don't like it at all when someone posts something that goes like this" it is the best kite in the world...I can fly upwind for 500 miles and get 500 feet in the air. PS you can get one of these at http://www.myshop.com." Those posts piss me off. We don't get any fact from them and all they do is negative to the whole forum theory. I have not tried to sell anything through the forums and I am sure if you look at where my harsh posts are you will see exactly what I am talking about.( go on now go look.) Also I am sure you will find that I post regularly to beginners looking for help regardless of what they ride. Also if you look at anything I post I never reccomend any particular brand of kite but suggest trying them all and finding the right one for you before buying. Sure sometimes I rip on foils but usualy only as adamantly as someone else is ripping on LEIS. A positive and unbiassed post directed at providing accurate informatiom on any kite has my total support, even though those kites are much more my direct competition than foils, but replying to a newbie looking for a new kite with a http://www.myshop.com posting on the forum to me is a bad way to sell a kite. Its like sending Grandma to a Chevy deallership to buy a Ford ( woops or I guess to a Mercedes deallership to buy a Porsche For the Europeans).
Of course as I always say thats just my opinion. Look at the first page of this post and see where my "harsh " posting was put. It is exactly why my posts ( sometimes ) are harsh. The guy telling someone why foils are better is directly involved in selling them. HMMMM I belive he's unbiassed.
Aloha Royce.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Royce on 2002-10-02 23:15 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: royce on 2002-10-02 23:50 ]</font>


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2002 12:09 am 
The Foil / LEI debate continues, but I think its more of a I ride an inflatable because everyone else dose syndrome.

I personally ride Foils because I'm from a kiting background, but for someone who has no idea about kites what choice do they really have? They have a lesson which will most probably be on a LEI, most people where they ride will be on LEI's so they follow and ride a LEI.

I'm regularly the odd one where I fly. I get people coming up to me all the time asking what the hell is that I'm flying, almost as if its a UFO attached to my harness.

A LEI rider had a go of my Flysurfer a few months back and was very impressed with it. His biggest comment was its ease of use and forgiveness in gusts. I think with the new development of foils such as the Psycho etc with true AOA will change the opinions of a few, but I guess only time will tell. I think people need to open up their minds a little and just ride what makes them have the most FUN, that's what its all about isn't it???


Top
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2002 1:02 am 
While shooting upwind on bullshit
Be careful or you may slip
You see water is full with each brand of bull
And people who ought to but won’t quit
Being one of the many with opinions o plenty
I say ride what you will
To hell with this swill
Fokiten is out
That’s my penny


Top
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2002 3:19 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 2374
Location: AUCKLAND, NEW ZEALAND
Both styles of kites have their specific conditions...

The choice of foil vs inflatable, directional vs twintip,
old school vs new school,
top end vs bottom end,
bar vs handles,
kitepants vs wetsuit vs Y fronts, :cool:
low AR vs high AR,
Rhino 2 vs X2,
hydrogen kite vs helium kite...

Don't you just love the variety!!!

BLOWN AWAY :smile:


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2002 6:27 am 
I don't want to say which design is better because I haven't really decided yet, but one thing I repeatably keep hearing about foils is that they are impossible to relaunch off the water.

With the well-designed new foil kites that statement is completely false. My flysurfer warrior 16.5 is super easy to relaunch. Just unhook and throw the bar away and the kite instantly relaunches backwards and rights itself. Then hook in sheet out and you are off.

There is no tugging on lines, swimming or superman lunges struggling to get the kite to roll over as with tube kites (especially high AR ones). All you have to do is unhook and drop the bar. I have had my flysurfer relaunch no problem after 10-15 minutes sitting on the water in waves around 1 meter. The few cups that get into the kite during this time quickly drain out the trailing edge as the kite launches.

Right now I am pretty certian that large foil kites are superior to large tube kites in light air. The big tube kites that I have tried tended to hindenburg in the lulls and were not water relaunchable within their wind range. The warrior 16.5 is light enough to stay up in the lulls and will water relaunch no problem in around 8 knots.

Having said that, my experience has been that newer tube kites I have tried are easier to jump and may have better hang time (than the warrior). They also seem to be better suited to high wind conditions, though I really haven't tried any of the newer foils in the small sizes (have some old ones though).

Sure there are trade-offs but each style has its advantages and both of them seem to be getting better and better these last couple of years.


Top
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2002 6:49 am 
Offline
Rare Poster

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2001 1:00 am
Posts: 8
Location: tim stockman
The reality is...... Whatever you own and fly you think is the best, true or not, whatever, who cares, get over it, this debate will probably go on forever. PLK F-ARCs are the biggest jumpers (but not user friendly if you ditch your kite), G-ARCs have the biggest windrange, and standard ARCs relaunch well, but what do I know, I fly SLINGSHOT...Ha Ha, Whatever you get you'll enjoy, and don't let others tell you different.
Hangloose, Tim.


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 49 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], MUDSUX, shawn13, tr3v, zfennell and 26 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group