*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 179 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ... 18  Next

Which kite brand do you fly?
Naish 12%  12%  [ 92 ]
Flysurfer 8%  8%  [ 60 ]
North 10%  10%  [ 79 ]
Ocean Rodeo 4%  4%  [ 28 ]
Best 15%  15%  [ 117 ]
Peter Lynn 6%  6%  [ 44 ]
Slingshot 8%  8%  [ 60 ]
Cabrinha 11%  11%  [ 87 ]
RRD 1%  1%  [ 8 ]
Gaastra 1%  1%  [ 8 ]
Flexifoil 1%  1%  [ 6 ]
Wipika 3%  3%  [ 20 ]
F-one 2%  2%  [ 19 ]
Takoon 3%  3%  [ 27 ]
Globerider 3%  3%  [ 22 ]
Liquid Force 3%  3%  [ 20 ]
Monkey 1%  1%  [ 8 ]
Other 5%  5%  [ 38 ]
Totally mixed 4%  4%  [ 34 ]
Caution 2%  2%  [ 16 ]
Total votes : 793
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: I fly Cabrinha!!
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:16 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2004 12:10 am
Posts: 1956
Location: A Best owner; ex F-One, SS, North, Cab owner
stuntc wrote:
I fly Cabrinha...Why, shop and school support....How many companies put as much time and effort into sponsoring schools and providing shops with such a great range of kites. Cabrinha isnt about a guy with a bunch of money trying to promote two year old technology with girls and dollar signs. Cabrinha is about performance, new technology, support, world champions, quality, not bs and hype. Eventually the dollars will run dry. And when they do the shops and schools will still be there doing the important jobs. Teaching newbies safely, providing quality equipment, keeping our beaches open. Cabrinha has always been a part of this. So in short support your local shop, they were probably the ones that taught you how to kite or picked you up after that downwinder or gave you a line when yours broke maybe lent you a harness when you forgot yours, or gave you equipment to try ot use while yours was getting fixed, maybe they did a beach clean-up to keep your spot looking right, or talked with the local town council to keep the beach open. How much is this worth to you? I ride Cabrinha!


It's late or early... but I am really tired of pea brain logic... by your moronic logic, all online kite shops should be ostracized, right? So that means neilprydemaui, kitehigh, kite-line, etc. aren't they taking away from local shops in far off places too...

As to assitance from shops... nothing bad to say... but they are far and too few... the reality is that most people get there lessons from independent instructors who are scraping by a living... think all of NYC... no shop... but plenty of kiters... more likely to get help from a fellow kiter than any shop.

I pay the park fee for the cleanup... seems the right way to do things.

By the way... schools typically are underserved by big brand distributors... their business is lessons... not selling equipment... don't have the capital/volume... why are they attracted to Best... visibility, traffic... make kiting more affordable... tend to generate more lessons... ask Real how's lesson business this year and how much Best gear they have moved... I am guessing a lot! Oh wait... can it be... Best gear at the biggest retail/school outfit... kind of contradict the inbred logic doesn't it!
What about kitepower, airhead, X-Klam, etc. I guess they don't count.

Here's a bit of enlightenment... retailers cares about high inventory turnover... that means they want goods that are sold before the shipment arrives... not shit that sit around and depreciates... I say 3 for 2 packages are a pretty easy sell for retailers and schools... and guess what... customers are thrilled to spend 1500 for 3 kites when they felt ripped off before to spend 1200 for one! Seems like a mutually beneficial thing to me.

And if you are so enthused about Cabby... make a big donation for such a good charitable cause... I am sure NeilPryde will appreciate it since it is tired of using Cab as a tax deduction again this year... that's actually a bad thing if you didn't realize it.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 3:59 pm 
Offline
Rare Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2004 3:54 pm
Posts: 23
Location: Saanichton Vancouver Island B.C. Canada
8) Ocean rodeo: 9m lively for gusty days..12m 2003 & 2004! 16m lots of Torque. Excellent support from a local company!! Did I mention TOUGH construction. I also ride the O.R. Mako board 18mm of concave! Holds like its on rails yet slides on waves!


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Vietkiter is old....
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 4:46 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 6:29 pm
Posts: 129
Vietkiter the war is over, I'm sure your retirement fund sucks thus not allowing you to buy quality equipment. As far as New York, Skater who is sponsored by Naish has taught the majority of people in the New York area and Island Surf and Sail sponsored in part by Cabrinha has taught the majority of lesons for NY city and Jersey not to mrntion the countless kitenights Slingshot has done to further promote safety and kiteboarding. What has best done to promote growth and safety? You may not know but alot of shops do care a bit more than just about numbers. I have kited nearly every location on the East coast and bottom line the shops and schools are the key, if Sandy Hook ever gets shut down blame yourself for not supporting the guys around you ie: Island surf and sail, and Winsurfing Hamptons..... You may be old but GROW UP..


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: Vietkiter is old....
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 6:09 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 12:41 am
Posts: 2757
Location: Portland, Oregon
stuntc wrote:
What has best done to promote growth and safety?


Safety AND Growth? I think they are mutually exclusive... maybe you should cheer for the dealer that doesn't need growth to survive.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Kite Brand?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:21 pm 
Offline
Rare Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 10:13 pm
Posts: 32
Location: VictoriaBC, Canada
I now fly Ocean Rodeo - for me the flight characteristics (lift, 'feel' and stability) and construction make it my favorite!

Cheers,

Paul


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2004 12:41 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2004 12:10 am
Posts: 1956
Location: A Best owner; ex F-One, SS, North, Cab owner
stuntc wrote:
Vietkiter the war is over, I'm sure your retirement fund sucks thus not allowing you to buy quality equipment. As far as New York, Skater who is sponsored by Naish has taught the majority of people in the New York area and Island Surf and Sail sponsored in part by Cabrinha has taught the majority of lesons for NY city and Jersey not to mrntion the countless kitenights Slingshot has done to further promote safety and kiteboarding. What has best done to promote growth and safety? You may not know but alot of shops do care a bit more than just about numbers. I have kited nearly every location on the East coast and bottom line the shops and schools are the key, if Sandy Hook ever gets shut down blame yourself for not supporting the guys around you ie: Island surf and sail, and Winsurfing Hamptons..... You may be old but GROW UP..


I am most offended that you think I sound like a grumpy old man! Need to tone my language down a bit. On the bright side, I am on the good side of 30 and already qualified for SS pension... but doubt I see any of it given the state of the system. No matter don't plan to depend on it.

The name is Skatoor (not Skater) and he is a great instructor no doubt... be prepared to be disciplined though. I think Real does a big chunk of business in NYC from people going to Hatteras. Don't forget Enzo (Kitewise.com) also... great instructor. I am sure there others.

If you really like to support instructors, make gears more affordable... their operating cost goes down, allowing them to make lessons more affordable... means less people will try to do it on their own... or take only two hours instead of the necessary 4-6 hours... or even week clinic like offered by kitewise.com.

I am not here to defend/attack Best... customers will have the ultimate say. If you so believe in the goodness of shops, shouldn't you write to NeilPryde and demand that Cabrinha not sell to NeilPrydeMaui, kitehigh, kite-line, etc. Please don't insult our collective intelligence with half baked dietribes.

Then you have to ask yourself... assuming that Real, Kitepower, etc. are doing fine financially with Best and at the same time providing affordable gear to the public, please explain to me what so bad about this picture? Do you think Trip or Steve don't know what's good for their shops?

By the way, what kind of people ride Best in the Hamptons... people with lots of money... wonder why... no matter how rich you are... it always fashionable to be the smart money than stupid money...

PS I have a Recon 17m CO2... don't use it much anymore... that was when I was the stupid money.

PS2 Slingshot and postitive image and safety? I have no comment. The DVD says it all.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2004 5:08 am 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 6:29 pm
Posts: 129
Vietkiter, no offense intended..... Heres the deal companies like Cabrinha and Naish etc need money to focus on new products, making them safer and more durable. Best uses a two year old design from EH ask them they will tell you. If someone wants two year old technology to save money, they can buy an 03 cabrinha or whatever, still a way better flyng kite than best and yes I have flown a few. Now when 05' gear comes out in a few months from Cabrinha and Slingshot like the Diesel, Best will be 3 years behind still trying to hype up there kites. At this point anyone can get an 04 Fuel, or CO2 for the same price as a best and still be nearly 2 years ahead in technology (not stupid money). I think its clear. I have nothing bad to say against the guys that run or ride for best. But let the truth be known.

As far as shop and school support, the majority of schools and shop based schools are sponsored by major companies. They get great deals on kites. Ask Skatoor or Trip. I do agree that kitehigh needs to be cut off. As far as Slingshot, I say nothing about there image but there thought into safety, durability and there kitenights they promote is positive. NY is a unique area because in most areas there are not many shops, but places like Florida where there are plenty, shop support is key, they are the ones usually fighting to keep kiting legal like Ft. Lauderdale or Miami, not internet based companies with one or two retailers. The local shops in Florida get great support from companies like Slingshot, Cabrinha or Naish not Best. Once again let the truth be known. Putting out tons of money to create an image, tits, girls, 2 for 1 = stupid money. Shop and school support to keep your place from being banned = smart money. You want 02/03 technology get something from a real kite company. You want bs and hype, you know were to go.....


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:09 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2004 12:10 am
Posts: 1956
Location: A Best owner; ex F-One, SS, North, Cab owner
stuntc, without rehashing all the previous points... I would say the concept that technology/style progression is linear only exists in the mind of the marketing/sale guys. Kites started being low aspect, then progress to bigger sizes and higher aspects. I think 2003 was the high water mark for the ultra high aspects... look at the x3, x10, lift pro etc... became to very narrow functionally and usability and not commercially successful, my guess... the trend toward more moderate aspect can be credited toward Slingshot... that is why high aspect kites are not so high aspect in 2004... I think for 95% of the people out there, the sweet spot is medium-high. Changes are sometimes better... sometimes much to do about nothing... 04 North... some like it... some still prefer the R2. My friends on Naish still prefer the x2 over the x3. The trend is also toward inflatable tips, not carbon batons... at least based on my limited observations. In fact, I think Best/EH kites is setting the trend toward thinner LEI profile... and perhaps this is why people have been surprised by the high jumps/control/upwind ability... I guessing again here... I am not a designer.

To me a great kite is a great kite... the LEI design has matured enough that changes are at most incremental, not revolutionary. We'll see if the flatter design of the Contra (theoretically greater pull for the same flat size) is not offset by higher instability (I don't know, never even seen the kite in person, just pondering based on aerodynamic tradeoffs).


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2004 9:30 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 12:41 am
Posts: 2757
Location: Portland, Oregon
I was flying my 13.5 Yarga yesterday and I think I was every bit as powered up as the rest of the peeps on the water who were on kites 04 big brand kites 16-20m (me = 75kg.) Only guy who looked like he had more juice was a guy on a R4 20m. Also there was a guy on 16m Vegas who was flying, and he was pretty big. There was a Contra 16.5 out, looked good. I got offered the opportunity to demo it, which I will try and do next time.

As to the comment that Best kites are two year old EH technology, well then EH must have been pretty ahead of the game in their time because these kites are easily better than any 03 kite I ever flew. The kites are sweet, stop trying to bag them, your just going to get flamed.

The argument that Cabrinha/Naish charge more so they can invest more in R&D is BS too, we've been through that argument already. Best gets just as much from selling their kites as any of the other brands (some guessed they get even more.) The kites are cheap because they streamlined the distribution model. The other companies are struggling because they are trying to keep the failing windsurfing industry alive with cash from kiteboarding. Things are expensive because of bad business models.

Anyway stuntc, I bet 10 to 1 that your last new kite purchased you didn't pay anything close to retail, or anything at all. So hush up. :-?

:bye:


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2004 10:24 pm 
Offline
Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2003 2:06 pm
Posts: 366
Location: haifa,Israel - Shenzhen,China
stuntc wrote:
. Best uses a two year old design from EH ....


cool, so don't get one....


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 179 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ... 18  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group