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do you want a license for kitesurfing?
yes 35%  35%  [ 44 ]
no 53%  53%  [ 66 ]
not sure 11%  11%  [ 14 ]
Total votes : 124
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 7:38 pm 
Toby,,

Could you add a "Fuck No" button?

Thanks,,no just doesn't do for me...

Regards
fokiten


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 7:50 pm 
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if we living in China


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:11 am 
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This makes no sense what-so-ever. This would really suck if you had to get a licens and what would it show?? I would really doubt that it would positivly effect us.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:13 am 
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Location: Mtn View, CA (S.F. Bay)
I'd like to see an independent organization (perhaps an existing one) that offers three things:

- Ratings (k1:beginner; k2: intermediate; k3:advanced)
- Insurance (say $1MM in liability insurance)
- A waiver (I won't sue anyone - no matter what)

Anyone who wants to join the organization can pay the appropriate fees for whichever of these items are desired. Crowded sites could require any combination of these to ride there. Sites that are not in danger wouldn't bother. That's basically (but not exactly) what we do in hang gliding. The United States Hang Gliding Association (USHGA) provides these things; and it definitely helps open sites that would otherwise never be opened.

If I (or any damn fool) wants to jump off a mountain in the middle of nowhere, they're free to do so - legally. If you want to fly at a restricted site you need to have the appropriate USHGA rating.

Who polices this? The pilots. We have helmet stickers that indicate our current rating status. If we see a pilot preparing to launch, we don't recognize him, and he doesn't have the sticker, we don't let him launch (don't want to lose our site). I realize not all kiters wear helmets - so a sticker might not work. In those cases we could have patches for kitepants :D

RC


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:44 am 
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Or perhaps on the harness, as everyone wears one, and generally the same one between different kites, boards, bars, pants. As per Australian Kite Surfing Association tag.

Say "I don't know" to the license question. All this conflict is so confusing. Who is right? Who is wrong? If I ignore it the problem will go away. Isn't that how it works?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:08 pm 
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For sure: I want THE OTHER GUY to have one.


jim


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:40 pm 
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Location: Yeppoon, Australia, instructor
kiting is quiet easy - if everything is alright.
Launching hooked in works for most kiters if you do it right and you have the lines attached correctly. as soon as you do a mistake - e.g. on one side the backlines to the front, the frontlines to the back - you get out of control from the first second.

Why do most kiters ignore all those bad accidents? I think because most of us are machos and just to cool to listen, learn and change things we used to do.
If we can prevent people from killing themselfs than we should do it.

Learning some simple and easy ways how to do it right so if shit happens you and others don't get into trouble can't hurt the sport.

Most accidents happen on the beach - I believe it must be over 90% - please correct me if somebody knows the excact statistic.

So the problem lies in launching and landing. I think that is the easiest part in kitesurfing. My students can safely launch and land within their first session which is just 2 hours. Waterstart, keeping upwind, jumps etc. will take many more hours to practise.

It is so simple but it must be soooo uncool: do not hook-in for launching; unhook when you are finished on the water and you are on the beach.

Sure for beginners they have no idea. But most people I guess just learn from a friend. And it looks like here it goes wrong. Old habbits are hard to change.

When I did the instructor course (in 2004) none of us 8 students knew or practised the un-hooked launching and landing. I guess all of us thought another stupid idea from IKO.
"...But then you launch fully powered up! NO WAY!"
I can tell you guys now that everyone of us are fully "converted" to the un-hooked launching. It's easy, simple and absolutely safe. It was an eye-opener. We might have lost that cool sliding on the beach while launching - but that's all.

I still see people on the beach with no safety and many hooked-in for launching. I might not be able to convince them (I'm constantly trying). But I think I'm making a difference already in teaching new kiters the "new" way.

for me it is a clear yes to license.
(what about diving? it's easy, you don't have to be fit - but it can be quiet dangerous if you are not taught properly.
noone with a bit of brain would just go and get a scuba tank, jump into the ocean and dive.)


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:11 pm 
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Quote:
Toby,,

Could you add a "Fuck No" button?

Thanks,,no just doesn't do for me...

Regards
fokiten


I agree with Fo.

I'm really into safety, wear a helmet and a crashjacket, use 5thE etc etc because i'm convinced of the use of them. I don't tell others to use this equipment as well, so i don't like others to tell me to launch unhooked or get a license... just talking to locals to get the local rules will do, we gotto talk and listen more.. to much said already
Bye


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 10:58 pm 
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Location: Yeppoon, Australia, instructor
basically you are saying that everyone should be free in doing whatever one likes. Sounds good when you are by yourself and not sharing the beach or water with someone else. Or you might kite at spots where it is cold and windy where you would not really come into touch with non kiting people.

I guess you will only change your mind when an accident imediatly involves you. all other accidents don't count.

true story:
my friend and I and few others are kiting in gusty 20 knots. Nice weather, it's about 28°C and the water is 27°C.
His little two daughters (3&5) are playing on the beach and are making a sandcastle. One of our friends (95kg) is kiting at the waters edge. a good gust picks him up about 4m in the air and drops him hard on the beach - just beside the girls.You hear a crash sound - the girls got scared - the kiter broke his angle. He is out of action for 3months. The daddy is happy that the kiter missed his girls...no worries.
That was lucky wasn't it. He didn't land on the girls while he was totally out of control and the wind dropped him whereever it wanted.

Now imagine he would have dropped onto the girls.
Now imagine these girls are your daughters!
You would learn at least then when it imediatly involves you and your family.
Would you now change your mind about accidents and what to learn from them?
A guy here lost in a kite accident his kidney, broke a few rips and badly scraped his leg on an oiyster bank - he tought himself, didn't have any safety measures and procedures to follow etc.

I could tell you more about close calls.

Every kiter spends thousends of Dollars in gear. Why not a few lessons to get him into safe kiting? It's easy and simple. Out in the water you can do whatever you want anyway!
A student learns most safety procedures in the first lesson. You don't have to do a full course and spent $500.

What about a "safety update - lesson" on the beach instead of a full licence?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:07 pm 
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Location: Houston, TX USA
In the USA you can buy a power boat that does 100 mph without a license or any idea about boating safety. How are you going to add a license to a sport like ours?
Regulations only create bureaucracies which require more taxation.
Now they will know who you are then after lobby's in Washington start on it they will require insurance (taxable)
This is a vicious cycle that will do nothing to protect anyone but the income of Bureaucrats
Wow I need to go ride!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Joel


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