*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Help needed, what do you call it where you ride???
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 3:44 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8278
Location: Florida
Bö,vræl,la ráfaga bourrasque,la bufera,a comoção ???

or ... SQUALLS!*

WHAT do you call UNSTABLE WEATHER where you ride ...

what does it LOOK LIKE ...

WHEN does it come ...

how can you PREDICT and AVOID it?

Unstable weather (or wx), can bring strong gusts that may fling you out of control, wind reversals that may spoil your day, Guys are smacking into hard impacts as a consequence of poor understanding or appreciation of the hazards of some local weather conditions.

less common Wx that have caused problems for kiteboarders also include cyclonic activity (waterspouts), wind gradients, dramatic drops in temperature, reduced visibility ...

Weather gone WRONG, like .. rider lofted into a parked car, a wall, tree, is dragged up the beach into ?, is pulled offshore by a wind reversal ... Lots of stories out there today and by current indications, MORE on the way tomorrow. Safety gear may help in this, along with good technique but no where as effectively as AVOIDANCE.

Unstable weather is something we should know about, to be sure. Lots of unnecessary accidents out there in 2002, 2003 could be even more intense UNLESS we build better hazard awareness out there.

So help your country men out and spread the word. Take a minute and fill out the questionnaire, cut and paste it into a message in this thread. If you have ideas on format or alternative questions please send them in. A final reference document will be prepared from your responses and spread around the Internet. An example entry appears below along with a blank form.

Thanks!

Country: USA

Area: Florida

Local Unstable Weather Name: Tropical Depressions

Time Of Year: Warmer months, summer

Characteristics: Sustained, good winds mixed with VIOLENT squalls characterized by sudden gusts to 40 to 60 mph or higher, rapid wind reversals, lightening, tornados and water spouts. May precede or follow hurricanes.

Predictive resources: Internet-http://www.nws.noaa.gov (many others), TV and radio

Appearance: MAY contain dark clouds, moderate to highly unstable wind speed and direction, lightening storms,

Comments: If a tropical depression is heading your way the best course is NOT to go kiteboarding. The variety and violence of these systems have injured kiteboarders already. Some weather systems are more tolerant of kiteboarding. Tropic Depressions appear to have enough surprises and accident experience already as to make them poor risks. Consider windsurfing in this kind of unstable Wx, barring lightening!



Blank Questionnaire:

Country:

Area:

Local Unstable Weather Name:

Time Of Year:

Characteristics:

Predictive resources:

Appearance:

Comments:


If you would like to included text in the comments in your own language or even better supply versions both in English and your language that would be outstanding.

Thanks for everyone’s help in this. If you have ideas for refining this concept please send them in.


*The terms were translated courtesy of http://www.freetranslation.com/, hopefully the terms provided are close to what is actually used.

FKA, Inc.

transcribed by:
Rick Iossi
flkitesurfer@hotmail.com


{ SHARE_ON_FACEBOOK } { SHARE_ON_TWITTER } { SHARE_ON_ORKUT } { SHARE_ON_DIGG } { SHARE_ON_MYSPACE } { SHARE_ON_DELICIOUS }
Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 4:10 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8278
Location: Florida
Here is another example:

Country: USA

Area: Florida

Local Unstable Weather Name: Thermal Storms

Time Of Year: Warmer months, late spring through early fall

Characteristics: a stack of high storm clouds build inland over the Everglades most afternoons and move slowly towards the ocean. As the line of clouds comes closer to the coast the thermal winds build in intensity often sideshore in direction. These systems may frequently be accompanied by lightening activity. Also they may bring sudden high gusts and wind reversals. Normally once they pass seaward, the winds die for a time or until the next afternoon.

Predictive resources: Internet: http://www.nws.noaa.gov/, lightning: http://www.flamedia.com/lightning/light.htm, checkout color radar

Appearance: an obvious 10 mile high line of storm clouds, cumulo nimbus clouds, moving slowing seaward. A slowly rising wind will accompany movement towards the coast. Lightning may appear when the mass comes close to the coast and may strike miles ahead of the line.

Comments:

Thermal winds often provide the only useable wind in Florida during the warmer months. That is aside from Tropical depressions, waves and hurricanes. These tropical systems are treated in another post. Riding in thermal winds with approaching thermal storms comes down to timing and to some degree, luck. You may choose to ride in these conditions but to come in before, the lightning, always a dodgy piece of guesswork, befrore strong gusty winds and rapid direction reversals come (not always but sometimes). So, if you are thinking of riding in thermal winds in Florida, look at the clock, at the cloud stack, check the lightening report (not always accurate), the color radar and decide. If things deteriorate while you are out come in fast to try to avoid problems.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 6:04 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 2185
Location: Spain/Italy
When out with a big kite in a nice constant thermal wind if you start seeing black clouds on the horizon or low white puffy ones or lots of whitecaps comming in, or sand or spray getting blown up, GET OUT FAST and wait to see what the weather's doing because these are all signs of big wind coming.

If you get hit by big wind some people say it's better to stay out and ride/jump it out rather than trying to come near land, I dunno.
Imo it's definately a good idea to stop before you get to this stage but if you do get caught out, stop planning before you get near to the shore, then come in bodydraging with the kite low, unhooked and/or ready to ditch it immediately if things are lookin doggy. Better to have someone ready to catch it.


Last edited by Mr Jo Macdonald on Thu Feb 20, 2003 6:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 6:18 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8737
rick:

you've got the benefit of much more accurate weather monitoring in the states than in the uk, its a bigger area there are more sample points and particularly you guys track systems moving up the coast, hurricane warnings and the like, in britain its just not that big a deal.

so.

whenever i'm out on the water i make sure that i've been watching the long range forcasts for a couple of days prior, to get a general feel.

when i get to the beach i'll wait round for a bit if the wind is up and down.

if its stormy then i'll always make sure that i'm looking into the wind every couople of tacks and looking at the chnages in the cloud formation.

if theres any obvious change in the light this usually signifies a change in the wind.

like wise cloud fronts and inversions are important to watch as well as the sea condition.

couple of months back a little squall came through. now you could see it five minutes beforehand, but it didin't look too bad. but if you were being cautious you could have come it. however a lot of people didn't and got lofted in 40-50mph winds when it had been blowing 18-25 five minutes before.


send pilch a private message, he was out in it, i was jsut watching it come up the beach.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 7:43 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8278
Location: Florida
Mr Jo Macdonald wrote:
When out with a big kite in a nice constant thermal wind if you start seeing black clouds on the horizon or low white puffy ones or lots of whitecaps comming in, or sand or spray getting blown up, GET OUT FAST and wait to see what the weather's doing because these are all signs of big wind coming.

If you get hit by big wind some people say it's better to stay out and ride/jump it out rather than trying to come near land, I dunno.
Imo it's definately a good idea to stop before you get to this stage but if you do get caught out, stop planning before you get near to the shore, then come in bodydraging with the kite low, unhooked and/or ready to ditch it immediately if things are lookin doggy. Better to have someone ready to catch it.


Thanks for the input Jo. Putting your comments into the following:

Country: Italy

Area: ?

Local Unstable Weather Name: Thermal winds (Italian +/or local names?)

Time Of Year: ?

Characteristics: Strong steady winds that may be accompanied by dark or white puffy clouds moving in on the horizon. Or, with a moving front of white caps or visible blowing sand, things may be changing and even stronger winds are likely on the way.

Predictive resources: ? If there is an Italian Internet site that is useful please mention it here, or TV or radio info

Appearance: A moving line of dark or white puffy clouds that may be accompanied by strong to very strong gusting winds, and (?) lightning and wind reversals(?)

Comments: If you get hit by big wind some people say it's better to stay out and ride/jump it out rather than trying to come near land, I dunno.
Imo it's definately a good idea to stop before you get to this stage but if you do get caught out, stop planning before you get near to the shore, then come in bodydraging with the kite low, unhooked and/or ready to ditch it immediately if things are lookin doggy. Better to have someone ready to catch it.

Good points and it is important to realize that more than a few riders have been injured by reacting or coming in, TOO LATE. Including the fellow that flew 250 m horizontally in Cabarete and poor Michele in France among others. If in doubt or if you see trouble on the way, get in a secure soon. If you are near shore and thinking it might hit the fan soon, depower your kite and swim in the rest of the way if local conditions support this.

Thanks again!


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 7:52 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8278
Location: Florida
sq225917 wrote:
rick:

you've got the benefit of much more accurate weather monitoring in the states than in the uk, its a bigger area there are more sample points and particularly you guys track systems moving up the coast, hurricane warnings and the like, in britain its just not that big a deal.

so.

whenever i'm out on the water i make sure that i've been watching the long range forcasts for a couple of days prior, to get a general feel.

when i get to the beach i'll wait round for a bit if the wind is up and down.

if its stormy then i'll always make sure that i'm looking into the wind every couople of tacks and looking at the chnages in the cloud formation.

if theres any obvious change in the light this usually signifies a change in the wind.

like wise cloud fronts and inversions are important to watch as well as the sea condition.

couple of months back a little squall came through. now you could see it five minutes beforehand, but it didin't look too bad. but if you were being cautious you could have come it. however a lot of people didn't and got lofted in 40-50mph winds when it had been blowing 18-25 five minutes before.


send pilch a private message, he was out in it, i was jsut watching it come up the beach.


I hear you, Wx prediction and real time condition sites do vary substantiallly from country to country. One of better setups that I have come across to date dealt with New Zealand. Don't sell the UK short though in terms of heavier Wx, from what I have read you guys have some whopper storms/squalls in many seasons of the year. That is quite a few impressive loftings. I have come across some Wx internet sites over that way. I recall that some weather types frequent the BKSA site and I need to go over there and repost this thread soon. Thanks for helping me on to the site!

So what do you guys call summer blows or storms? How about some like the one you described in winter? What sort of dodgy conditions do you see associated with inversions? Oh, and what part of the UK do you ride in most of the time? Thanks for the insight on leading indicators of trouble moving in. The change in light aspect is not all that effective in my area but it sounds like it is more telling in yours. I imagine that these terms may change a bit as you move around the UK.

Thanks for your input!


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 10:00 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 2185
Location: Spain/Italy
RickI wrote:
Mr Jo Macdonald wrote:
When out with a big kite in a nice constant thermal wind if you start seeing black clouds on the horizon or low white puffy ones or lots of whitecaps comming in, or sand or spray getting blown up, GET OUT FAST and wait to see what the weather's doing because these are all signs of big wind coming.

If you get hit by big wind some people say it's better to stay out and ride/jump it out rather than trying to come near land, I dunno.
Imo it's definately a good idea to stop before you get to this stage but if you do get caught out, stop planning before you get near to the shore, then come in bodydraging with the kite low, unhooked and/or ready to ditch it immediately if things are lookin doggy. Better to have someone ready to catch it.


Thanks for the input Jo. Putting your comments into the following:

Country: Italy

Area: Adriatic north-east coast

Local Unstable Weather Name: Constant thermal wind Scirocco SE, pressure induced storm winds but pretty constant most of the time Bora/Grecale E, Tramontana NE,
Time Of Year: Spring to autumn, afternoon SE thermals (6-12 knots), known to pick up towards dusk, winter means kiting in unstable stormy weather, mostly onshore and bloody cold too (bora E-NE, usually 10-20 knots but can hit 50, normally hits during the night and drops off as the day passes, but can last 3-4 days), the scirocco can also be a stormy winter wind that lasts for weeks, very gusty and unpredictable in the winter.
Characteristics: Strong steady winds that may be accompanied by dark or white puffy clouds moving in on the horizon. Or, with a moving front of white caps or visible blowing sand, things may be changing and even stronger winds are likely on the way.

Predictive resources: ? http://wind.surfreport.it/, teletext is pretty acurate too, always ask the locals if in doubt

Appearance: A moving line of dark or white puffy clouds that may be accompanied by strong to very strong gusting winds, and (?) lightning and wind reversals(?)

Comments: If you get hit by big wind some people say it's better to stay out and ride/jump it out rather than trying to come near land, I dunno.
Imo it's definately a good idea to stop before you get to this stage but if you do get caught out, stop planning before you get near to the shore, then come in bodydraging with the kite low, unhooked and/or ready to ditch it immediately if things are lookin doggy. Better to have someone ready to catch it.

Good points and it is important to realize that more than a few riders have been injured by reacting or coming in, TOO LATE. Including the fellow that flew 250 m horizontally in Cabarete and poor Michele in France among others. If in doubt or if you see trouble on the way, get in a secure soon. If you are near shore and thinking it might hit the fan soon, depower your kite and swim in the rest of the way if local conditions support this.

Thanks again!


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2003 4:14 pm 
Rick. No worries mate.
Puerto Rico
All year
Gust fronts ( squalls) associated with unstable cumulus and cumulo nimbus developing over inland mountain ranges
Occurs during dissapating stages of thunderstorms inland
Results in strong unstable wind gusts occasionally exceeding 30knots followed by rapid offshore wind direction changes and dropping wind velocity
The weather station does not predict it but NOAA sometimes warns on the marine forecats. Easilly recognizeable due to huge black cloud and heavy rain spreading from the inland mountain ranges to the shoreline. Lightning may be present.
Winds will be gusty and varying in direction.
Avoid it mostly due to gustiness, lightning and offshore wind direction and velocity changes.
Aloha Royce.


Top
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2003 10:43 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8278
Location: Florida
Anonymous wrote:
Rick. No worries mate.
Puerto Rico
All year
Gust fronts ( squalls) associated with unstable cumulus and cumulo nimbus developing over inland mountain ranges
Occurs during dissapating stages of thunderstorms inland
Results in strong unstable wind gusts occasionally exceeding 30knots followed by rapid offshore wind direction changes and dropping wind velocity
The weather station does not predict it but NOAA sometimes warns on the marine forecats. Easilly recognizeable due to huge black cloud and heavy rain spreading from the inland mountain ranges to the shoreline. Lightning may be present.
Winds will be gusty and varying in direction.
Avoid it mostly due to gustiness, lightning and offshore wind direction and velocity changes.
Aloha Royce.


Country: USA

Area: Puerto Rico

Local Unstable Weather Name: Gust or Squall Fronts

Time Of Year: All Year

Characteristics: Gust fronts ( squalls) associated with unstable cumulus and cumulo nimbus developing over inland mountain ranges
Occurs during dissapating stages of thunderstorms inland
Results in strong unstable wind gusts occasionally exceeding 30knots followed by rapid offshore wind direction changes and dropping wind velocity. Winds will be gusty and varying in direction.

Predictive resources: The weather station does not predict it but NOAA sometimes warns on the marine forecats.

Appearance: Easilly recognizeable due to huge black cloud and heavy rain spreading from the inland mountain ranges to the shoreline. Lightning may be present.

Comments: Avoid it mostly due to gustiness, lightning and offshore wind direction and velocity changes.

THANKS ROYCE!!! I remember that your high mountains can cause some unusual wx conditions. Thanks for giving all the detailed, good information.

So, come on all you kiteboarders out there, please supply this information for your area. This information may build just that little bit of awareness that may save a rider some serious trouble at YOUR launch someday.

FKA, Inc.

transcribed by;
Rick Iossi


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2004 2:29 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 8278
Location: Florida
This came out about a year ago. It sure would help to learn more about gusty unstable weather in various parts of the world and then to spread what we have figured out.

So, how about it guys, WHAT do they call squally, unstable weather where you ride? More critically, what tips you off it is coming, at what times of year, etc. We really need to get a better handle on this.


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baidu [Spider], Don Monnot, Google Feedfetcher, jannik, nicor, sijandy, tandemkitesurf, xenosd, Yahoo [Bot] and 32 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group